Forums > MaxMSP

Best Start Kit for MAX for LIVE

September 8, 2009 | 5:33 am

Although it appears that Max for LIVE will have most of the API’s available in it, I do not yet have a Micro-controller that I use with MAX/MSP and want to start with one.

I understand that Arduino Deumilanove USB is a good choice. Is this the best one to get,

http://www.robotshop.ca/arduino-experimentation-kit.html

Can anybody refer me to any more complete kits?

Also, there’s the consideration of the new EBody2 Wireless for Sensory Interface. This sounds like a good option.

So my question is, even though the EBody2 Wireless is a bit expensive for my tastes it looks like a good way to go — but with which kit, Arduino or Make Controller Kit?

I’ve been programming in C and C++ for over 10 years so I have no problem using Arduino’s IDE.

However, I doubt that the Make Controller Kit will go long before they respond to the "community" of open source that is bourgeoning out there.

IN THE END…for me, it’s about what the Best Choice is for MAX for LIVE as I’m not as interested in Building a Robot as I am in Sensory Input and modifying music to an environment, and that includes potentially trying to control a network of hundreds of not thousands of LED’s tied to a Black FishNet that is spread and draped across a stage for small venue performance.

Anyone have any ideas on the best options here?

I’m not interested in large flat panel displays, I want more abstract control; I also would like to hook a shotgun mic up to my Gibson HD.6X.Pro Les Paul and allow targeting of source sources (parts of crowds) to affect sound, and even vocode in some instances with Fan in front of an Amp for Rotor like Feedback (i.e. using the shotgun mic mounted on the HD.6X.Pro and routed to the EBody2 Wireless; I assume an Audio level can map to a MIDI message for it, correct?).

Feedback is very much appreciated.


September 26, 2009 | 10:22 am
metamorphfly wrote on Tue, 08 September 2009 07:33
Feedback is very much appreciated.

Strangely there is no reply to your visionairy projects yet. First of all, what you try to do sounds damn interesting, please keep us posted…

Personally I just bought my first arduino board (an arduino BT) and I am really getting excited about it. I bet Arduino is the best way to go. Its open source, there are plenty of alternative compatible boards out there, its an open environment. As you need custom electronics for your project, it seems a perfect companion.
The Eobody is just sensors, for driving leds you’d need outputs as well…
The Arduino is cheap, in terms of hardware, it asks for much more to learn, but this will pay off later, especially if you have a project like that in mind…

I guess you come from the Live world, welcome to Max, you’ll get all the help you need here.

Good luck

Stefan


September 26, 2009 | 7:17 pm

Thanks.

I will keep you posted.

I plan on getting the Arduino MAX and have posted them a question.

"Physical Computing" is really becoming more popular.

The Machina X is fascinating they have, but it seems a bit expensive per unit.

If the price gets lower and there’s smaller servos, we’re talking real cybot type of ‘emergence’ re-assembly (i.e. the dream of making a real little robot that you could kick and break apart and each piece would crawl back and put itself back together).

I’ve already got a FLEX project underway to do this in 3D simulation, but the actual Physical Computing part of this is fascinating.

In my simulation it’s more for playing and teaching at the same time.

I’ll be back…have tog et paid before I can get the Arduino Max, the there’s using several Arduino Max’s together via USB to sync them up in terms of timecode. I’m working with the Mac OS X USB in XCode.

talk to you later.


September 27, 2009 | 5:27 pm
metamorphfly wrote on Mon, 07 September 2009 22:33
So my question is, even though the EBody2 Wireless is a bit expensive for my tastes it looks like a good way to go — but with which kit, Arduino or Make Controller Kit?

Look at this:

http://www.makingthings.com/arduino-comparison

I’ve used both. I like the MCK because I can address it over ethernet using OSC. I find it easier to use, on the Max side. Also, the h-bridges on the app board are handy for controlling motors.

But, it is much more expensive. If you can do your project with Arduino, you’ll save some money. And, as you’ve noted, the Arduino community is bigger and find solutions there.

I don’t do much programming on either of them; I get the data into Max and work there.

mz


September 27, 2009 | 8:38 pm

So the MCK can work via Wireless Ethernet also, correct?

I’d frankly rather use MAX for LIVE with Make Controller Kit (MCK) than that.

32 general purpose I/O’s – what exactly does that mean in terms of analog voltage range coming in, or out, or both?

PWM (Pulse Width Modulation) what is this typically used for in applications; I know how I’d use it in Music, but what about Robotics?

It says also, 4 "hobby" servo connectors.

That word "hobby" worries me, because when it comes to servos you want them strong (the right ratio of motor strength and gear leverage), and samll.

http://www.LiquidWare.com seems to have an aweful lot of hardware in their stock. I’ve had and read the book on "Physical Computing" but am looking for more details in terms of MAX for LIVE usage.

That is my ultimate goal; an interdisciplinary use of MAX within Live, and have broad access, and I’d like to go down to the C++ level if I have to as I’ve developed in C++ for over 20 years since I was in high school.

Cost is not an issue when it comes to Sweat-Equity in Purchasing and Intellectually investing in the truth-worthiness of a company (i.e. I never trust Microsoft, they patented something of mine after inviting me to a "Partners in Innovation" show, yet their main defense in DOJ v MS was "Freedom to Innovate" what a bunch of Bald Ballmer Monkey Dancers; guess what I found out after 10 years, my attorney went to Detroit Country Day with my attorney and he never tells me this; it’s a wicked world out there; I got 2 months left to find an atty. to deal with this before grievance).

Sorry for the Spat…but I DO TRUST C’74, that’s one of the only reasons I’m here. I trust Ableton also.

MAKE vs. Arduino — who has been more friendly to their developers?

Looks like Arduino is independent so it may be the way to go and frankly I don’t see the MCK (which I was set on) as the best, but rather the Arduino MAX. 52 i/o’s, 6 PWM, some 13 other Analog in’s I believe.


September 28, 2009 | 7:21 pm

Hello,
The Eobody2HF is a standalone sensor interface. You won’t need an arduino or MCK in addition to that if all you want is to plug sensors in. My one complaint about Arduino is the use of the FTDI chip to convert serial to USB causes a great deal of latency. That said, the cost of getting started is very low, and you could upgrade to a more expensive board after getting comfortable with the electronics. The MCK and Eobody2HF don’t exhibit this problem.

It is a great time to get into physical computing now, as there are way more options available at various price-scales than only a few years ago.

Best,
Andrew B.


September 28, 2009 | 7:58 pm

Which boards will work best for "Live" performance in small venues using Ableton Live 8 w/ MAX for LIVE interfacing to what physical computing kits…that’s the question on the horizon to me.

I’d love to spend my time with things like the Illuminata X Machina (not in response to your post just a point) but I’ve been into Physical Computing long enough where I want to get my hands dirty with some real reliable working equipment on stage with MAX for LIVE.

I saw the "Flaming Lips" the other night on-what’s-his-names-show and although I love the F.L. one guy had a double neck guitar with a KAOSSILATOR hooked on to it, but he didn’t really seem to integrate it with any kind of unit, just used a phrase at the end.

I’ve taken mine apart and put it back together because what I really want to do is feed my own data to the unit-rehoused, but with my own input: it appears to take simply a matrix of positions, up to 3 of those positions per point, and 3 levels of depth in terms of pressure you apply to each of those positions.

I often spider walk 3 fingers around the units fingerpad.

But again, I’d like to have my own input from MAX/MSP into the unit, and then, although Jitter could do this it would be overkill, use MAX/MSP to receive wired output from the LED.

Why? Because sometimes your live with the Kaosc. and sometimes you just put it into phrase play mode and it would be nice to get feedback endlessly.

If anyone figures out how to intercept the wiring to control the finger surface, and intercept the same wiring to read the output that would be great.

Now that’s not Physical Computing per se, but it’s hacking…but add a shot-gun mic and some infra-red sensors with drunkard’s walk and Lévy flight like Markov random walks and you got yourself some Brownian Motion on a warm sunny day (or a hot stage).


September 29, 2009 | 9:48 pm
metamorphfly wrote on Sun, 27 September 2009 13:38
So the MCK can work via Wireless Ethernet also, correct?

You could connect it to any router your computer was connected to, wireless or otherwise.

Quote:
32 general purpose I/O’s – what exactly does that mean in terms of analog voltage range coming in, or out, or both?

I think it’s 0-5V in or out, or digital. It depends on how you power the board, though. You won’t get 5v from USB.

PWM (Pulse Width Modulation) what is this typically used for in applications; I know how I’d use it in Music, but what about Robotics?

Dimming lights, controlling the speed of DC motors…

Quote:
It says also, 4 "hobby" servo connectors.

That word "hobby" worries me, because when it comes to servos you want them strong (the right ratio of motor strength and gear leverage), and samll.

If you wanted to control a heavier motor, I would do it through a relay. The MCK has some protection against blowback current, but it isn’t infinite.

Quote:
Looks like Arduino is independent so it may be the way to go and frankly I don’t see the MCK (which I was set on) as the best, but rather the Arduino MAX. 52 i/o’s, 6 PWM, some 13 other Analog in’s I believe.

Sounds like a wise decision. Arduino is open source hardware and software. You can be assured that there will be boards and users for a long time in the future.

mz


May 12, 2010 | 10:40 pm

I’m currently using Arduino with a Bluetooth Mate module to build a wireless controller. It is absolutely viable to use it with Max4Live! If you’re interested in the project, drop me a line to alkopop79 at gmail dot com!

Greg


Viewing 9 posts - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)