Cycling 74 » Topic: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data? http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/feed Wed, 19 Jun 2013 06:22:34 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=2.2.4 http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-57314 <![CDATA[digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-57314 Thu, 26 May 2011 15:55:11 +0000 n00b_meister Hallo
I’m afraid i’m still losing sleep over this one:

When one presses on a resistive touchpanel, there is a minute ramp up to the ‘exact’ or real XY location value; this is mainly due to the mechanics of this type of sensor implementation, but also caused in some part by a function i have implemented to simply detect touch: when the device is ‘dormant’, the sensors are forced back to ground, giving me a zero. Nice. And in Processing I’ve got a little averaging array. But the ramping-up noise is still there and giving me nightmares etc, so I’ve implemented three different algorithms in Max to try to address this issue; 1. a simple gate for discrete touches; 2. a lowpass onepole filter + zl stream/zl median; 3. downsampling.

I hope to be able to access both discrete and continuous touch data accurately, and, having pounded this forum and others mercilessly, still no success……..please have a glance at the commented patch below and suggest anything (except [lbyl], it does lowfreq noise very well but not applicable in this instance): capacitors, welding rods, a hammer whatever!

– Pasted Max Patch, click to expand. –

That’s two queries then i suppose; how to deal with ramping to, and vacillation around the ‘real’ touch value; and, how to access both discrete and continuous touch data.

Brendan (the ‘touchpanel-noise guy’, that’s me)

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205316 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205316 Fri, 27 May 2011 18:44:17 +0000 k9 Maybe you should look at the slide/slide~ objects. I believe that does what you are looking for.

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205317 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205317 Fri, 27 May 2011 21:51:15 +0000 Simon Hmm, with IR sensors a capacitor near the sensor will smooth that junk. I can’t recall the exact circuit off hand, but easy to find.

hth

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205318 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205318 Sat, 28 May 2011 12:27:04 +0000 n00b_meister @k9 thanks for the suggestion, but as I understand it, [slide] does logarithmic smoothing, and lowpass filtering, both of which perform a type of interpolation on the number stream; in effect, the noise is merely delayed or interpolated, not ignored. But I haven’t applied [slide] yet so i’ll get back to you.

@Simon thanks also, but i’m using a resistive touch panel; I have various capacitor values and most texts I’ve referred to mention capacitors in the context of 50/60Hz mains interference and electronic interference from other devices, but again, I’ll try the capacitor trick too.

Brendan

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205319 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205319 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 04:03:26 +0000 Anneke Hi :)

sorry probably wont be able to help out much. Just interested in what your doing. What is it that you’re actually making? A DIY touchpad or something? Like what you’ll get in an iphone? Plus can you detect multitouch?

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205320 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205320 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 04:54:49 +0000 Chris Muir Have you looked at the smoothing numbers thread to see if there might be some ideas you could use?

http://cycling74.com/forums/topic.php?id=15180

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205321 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205321 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 12:43:34 +0000 n00b_meister @Anneke
this is one of the core elements of my current PhD in accessible interaction design – I’m designing and prototyping a digital musical instrument interface for musician-performers with cerebral palsy; the touchscreen will control a variety of synthesis engines in MaxMSP, hopefully resulting in an interface/instrument similar to Roger Linn’s Linnstrument, but, due to the limited capabilities of my participants, not availing of any multitouch functionality.

@Chris
was hoping you’d drop by; of course, the solutions in your link form the core of my ‘max utilities’ folder – signal processing is where my project often gets stuck. I have resolved to ‘ameliorate’ rather than solve this issue as it is a perennial and fundamental issue with resistive touchpanels. Sometimes you just gotta put your hands up and say “Ok, I give up, you win”.
The solution? Bigger pulldown resistors on all the inputs, a large for-loop ‘averaging array’ in Arduino, and finally [zl stream 3] ->[zl median]. Seems to be a good trade-off between noisy responsiveness and latent accuracy.
Watch this space……

Brendan

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205322 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205322 Wed, 01 Jun 2011 17:53:45 +0000 Chris Muir FWIW, I’ve put a milder version of my [Flatline] solution into the firmware of some hardware products that I sell, with pretty good results when used for knob smoothing.

In the case of the touch screen, perhaps a simple passive lowpass filter before it hits the A/D of the Arduino would be good. Also, have you grounded any unused A/D inputs of the Arduino?

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205323 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205323 Thu, 02 Jun 2011 13:10:49 +0000 n00b_meister Hi Chris

if you are suggesting capacitors on the inputs, which values would you recommend? The touchpanel is rated at around 300-900 Ohms resistance I believe. In the past I’ve never had to force unused inputs to ground, but then I’ve never encountered such jitter before – but when the panel is dormant i.e. untouched, there is no noise or jitter whatsoever; the jitter stems purely from the minute fluctuations in fingertip contact location due to finger pressure and movement. While I’m here…..how should I connect the caps to the inputs; they are currently all pulled to ground via 10k.

Best wishes
Brendan

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205324 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205324 Thu, 02 Jun 2011 18:07:29 +0000 Chris Muir It’s sort of hard to guess at a filter without knowing what the rest circuit looks like.

It may be to “steppy” for your liking, but [flatline] comes close to meeting your requirements, otherwise.

– Pasted Max Patch, click to expand. –
]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205325 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205325 Fri, 03 Jun 2011 09:56:33 +0000 n00b_meister Chris
Thanks; you're quite right – for discrete triggers [flatline] is ok, but less so for continuous data. Hmmm. I have a variety of caps here, from .01uF to .47uF, which I could try – despite much googling I can't find an example circuit. My circuit looks like this; do you know if the caps should be placed before or after the pulldown resistor on each read line?

Cheers
Brendan

[attachment=163606,2324]

]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205326 <![CDATA[Re: digital filter, to exclude noisy touch data?]]> http://cycling74.com/forums/topic/digital-filter-to-exclude-noisy-touch-data/#post-205326 Fri, 17 Jun 2011 09:31:35 +0000 FRid A wild guess here but have you tried hooking up a coil/inductor. Definitely no expert but i believe this is the electronical equivalent of [rampsmooth]

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