Forums > MaxMSP

I´m new!. What´s the diference with live?

July 10, 2007 | 11:33 am

Hello, I


July 10, 2007 | 11:54 am

Quote: gamuso wrote on Tue, 10 July 2007 13:33
—————————————————-
> Hello, I


July 10, 2007 | 12:04 pm

Yes, I know that…

but using live together with other small applications, the IAC driver, your imagination and some scripts and other stuff everething can be done… without becoming cracy.

so, can anybody tell me some concrete thing that can be achieved with cycling software but not with live?

thank you so.


July 10, 2007 | 1:14 pm

Quote: gamuso wrote on Tue, 10 July 2007 14:04
—————————————————-
> Yes, I know that…
>
> but using live together with other small applications, the IAC driver, your imagination and some scripts and other stuff everething can be done… without becoming cracy.

So.. why exactly are you looking for something else?

>
> so, can anybody tell me some concrete thing that can be achieved with cycling software but not with live?

Is there anything specific you’d want to do? I can think of an endless amount of things that can be done with MaxMSP that can’t be done with Live, like building your own synths and effects, feeding multiple live camera inputs into a 3D environment, compiling the bassiest parts of a database of samples into a new algorithmic soundscape, start an audio recording as soon as your colleague dials one out of a selection of numbers on her company phone, stream the recording over a network to a computer in the next room and lock the door of her office when your name is mentioned twice after five minutes.

But it’s hard to say whether these apply to you. It can very well be true that for your requirements, Live with some plugins and scripts is perfect.

Btw, I am not a cycling ’74 official, just a user. If you need promotional material about the products cycling ’74 offers I wouldn’t recommend to access the users community but I’d just send a request to info(at)cycling74.com. Although I don’t recall ever seeing a readymade flyer with flashy one-liners or anything..

Cheers,
Mattijs

>
>
> thank you so.
—————————————————-


July 10, 2007 | 2:54 pm

I’m not a live user but i’d imagine you’d have a hard time doing this with live:

http://www.soundofcities.com/Magazin/SoundtrapII.html

best,

john.


July 10, 2007 | 3:04 pm

check out the inverviews on youtube:

http://youtube.com/results?search_query=cycling%2074&search=Search

wes

On 7/10/07, Leafcutter John

wrote:
>
> I’m not a live user but i’d imagine you’d have a hard time doing this with live:
>
> http://www.soundofcities.com/Magazin/SoundtrapII.html
>
> best,
>
> john.
> –
> http://www.leafcutterjohn.com
>
> "The Forest And The Sea"
> Out on Staubgold Records
> June 6th (US) 12th (Rest of the world)
> Staubgold 68 CD/LP
>


July 10, 2007 | 4:23 pm

I just got live last week, ableton is about to collab with c74 which is extreeeemly exciting to me.

comparing max and live is not very useful, there are two different things entirely. max can do whatever you want but you have to do alot more work, live is ready and there for you to just click a few times and have something clean sounding going.


July 10, 2007 | 5:23 pm

And of course http://www.smadsteck.nl/. Only just an impression of what we do of course, but everything in that movie is MaxMSP..

Mattijs

Quote: wesley.hoke@gmail.com wrote on Tue, 10 July 2007 17:04
—————————————————-
> check out the inverviews on youtube:
> http://youtube.com/results?search_query=cycling%2074&search=Search
>
> wes
>
> On 7/10/07, Leafcutter John

wrote:
> >
> > I’m not a live user but i’d imagine you’d have a hard time doing this with live:
> >
> > http://www.soundofcities.com/Magazin/SoundtrapII.html
> >
> > best,
> >
> > john.
> > –
> > http://www.leafcutterjohn.com
> >
> > "The Forest And The Sea"
> > Out on Staubgold Records
> > June 6th (US) 12th (Rest of the world)
> > Staubgold 68 CD/LP
> >
>
—————————————————-


July 10, 2007 | 6:43 pm

Max is most certainly not limited to music and sequencing either. It provides a graphical programming environment for anything that can be represented by numbers — everything in the digital realm from audio to video to databases to vectors to logical structures to … …

Live is fantastic and can be augmented well by Max but is totally workable as a stand-alone. Max can do a lot more variety of things but some of the more sophisticated stuff requires a lot of fiddling. That same fiddling has already been done in an app like Live — you’re the end user of an app that is very very flexible and does a lot of things in music very well. But it’s not a programming environment of nearly the scope of Max, nor does it need or claim to be for how it’s generally used.

I love building little scraps and doodads and seeing what they do in Max, though admittedly I haven’t produced much music with it. That’s OK, the process and "thinking structures" are more than enough to keep me interested, I just keep going to the next experiment. As an example, for my dissertation I originally was going to develop music theory and keyboarding curricula in Max, and this is certainly quite doable in this well-suited environment. Now I’m going to develop elementary and middle-school Math Ed modules and curricula instead…another perfect project for Max, especially with its support for Javascript and OpenGL.

Just some of the pretty-much-infinite things you can do with this seemingly-never-ending software. It just depends what you want to do and how much you like tinkering.

–CJ


July 10, 2007 | 6:47 pm

The question is not what can you do with Max. Max allows
to do ANYTHING you want to do. The real question is what
do you really want to do. Ableton is an application that does
what it does. The problem is, you will never be able to
go beyond what it does. If all you want to do is mix loops
together and sequence then I guess you don’t need Max.

Anthony

—– Original Message —–
From: Mattijs Kneppers
Date: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 12:25 pm
Subject: [maxmsp] Re: Re: I� m new!. What� s the
diference with live?

>
> And of course http://www.smadsteck.nl/. Only just an impression of
> what we do of course, but everything in that movie is MaxMSP..
>
> Mattijs
>
> Quote: wesley.hoke@gmail.com wrote on Tue, 10 July 2007 17:04
> —————————————————-
> > check out the inverviews on youtube:
> > http://youtube.com/results?search_query=cycling%2074&search=Search
> >
> > wes
> >
> > On 7/10/07, Leafcutter John

wrote:
> > >
> > > I’m not a live user but i’d imagine you’d have a hard time
> doing this with live:
> > >
> > > http://www.soundofcities.com/Magazin/SoundtrapII.html
> > >
> > > best,
> > >
> > > john.
> > > –
> > > http://www.leafcutterjohn.com
> > >
> > > "The Forest And The Sea"
> > > Out on Staubgold Records
> > > June 6th (US) 12th (Rest of the world)
> > > Staubgold 68 CD/LP
> > >
> >
> —————————————————-
>
>
> –
> SmadSteck – http://www.smadsteck.nl
> Hard- and software for interactive audiovisual sampling
>


July 10, 2007 | 7:08 pm

On 10 Jul 2007, at 15:54, Leafcutter John wrote:

> I’m not a live user but i’d imagine you’d have a hard time doing
> this with live:
>
> http://www.soundofcities.com/Magazin/SoundtrapII.html

or

http://www.cassiel.com/triptychos

or

http://www.cassiel.com/audiotierra

or any of thousands of other projects which go past on this list.

Actually, I’m rather fond of Live, and tend to use Live plus MaxMSP
in tandem when performing, either Rewired together or via Pluggo.

– N.

Nick Rothwell / Cassiel.com Limited
http://www.cassiel.com
http://www.myspace.com/cassieldotcom
http://www.loadbang.net


July 10, 2007 | 7:47 pm

Another example: while apps like Live allow you to record parameter automations and have full Undo functionality (no small feats, to be sure), what about being able to play back those automations at any speed (independent of global tempo? in either direction? accessing them non-linearly? providing a wealth of interpolation types between any points within them? redirecting certain changing parameters to new targets? how about saving "automations of your automations" so that *sequences* of full, pre-recorded automations are possible?

For undos — you can save all your past history states of your interface objects in data files, then access them at will. Not many apps allow one to, say, automatically scroll through your past 100 history states of parameters (or any subset) at any speed or direction, using lots of different interpolations, while your sequence is playing, to see how they affect the result.

For audio files: while creating a rich editor for audio files in Max would take some effort, the waveform~ object (with only a couple hours of development), I feel, competes quite well with those in commercial apps like Audition or Live, and can boast unique features like automated zoom, practically unlimited selection history (accessible any way one wishes including non-linearly), highly flexible and malleable snap-to-grid, and so on. And when you’ve chosen your loopable selection, the playback possibilities for looping can definitely be superior (given the level of control / automation / modulation possible with signals to groove~). Not to mention that one can have as many instances of the waveform~ going simultaneously as one wants and that your computer can handle.

These kinds of manipulations of your data are pretty straightforward in Max and can produce some really interesting and unique results. In particular, real-time changing of these manipulations themselves are where Max really shines and can provide functionality that is rare elsewhere, or is at least cumbersome to achieve.

–CJ


July 10, 2007 | 9:29 pm

THANKS A LOT!!. Right now I


July 11, 2007 | 7:32 pm

gamuso schrieb:
> but using live together with other small applications, the IAC
> driver, your imagination and some scripts and other stuff everething
> can be done… without becoming cracy.

Yeah, you would need Max only if you are already crazy…

How do you create an algorithmic sound installation which never repeats
itself in Live, and would run for several years? Even if you could do
overlapping loops of irrational length ratios, the rules I implemented
in Max would not be possible, unless I create a Pluggo in Max which
implements them.

If you want to explore the continuum versus an event based thinking, I
guess it will be very difficult in Live, though it might be possible,
but why easy, if you can have it complicated…

> so, can anybody tell me some concrete thing that can be achieved with
> cycling software but not with live?

You horizont seems to be limited to score/timeline based music. You
probably haven’t explored the limits of Live yet. If you’re happy with
Live, stick with it…

And don’t get me wrong, you can do stuff in Live easily, which would be
hard to achieve in Max. (Though it would still be possible…)

But all my music would have just never happened without my own
programming, most of it in Max…

Stefan


Stefan Tiedje————x——-
–_____———–|————–
–(_|_ —-|—–|—–()——-
– _|_)—-|—–()————–
———-()——–www.ccmix.com


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