Max 6 Sneak Peek: Usability

Aug 24, 2011 at 10:35pm

Max 6 Sneak Peek: Usability

We’re excited to share all sorts of things about Max 6, so we asked our developers to talk about some the things they are excited about. The first of these Sneak Peek videos is here:

http://cycling74.com/2011/08/24/sneak-peek-at-max-6-usability-features/

#58562
Aug 24, 2011 at 11:08pm

We need to know if it will have multitouch support!! (^_^)

Amazing the video!!

#210480
Aug 25, 2011 at 5:49am

I’m really impressed with what’s shown there. Those are some really good ideas! Bravo.

#210481
Aug 25, 2011 at 6:17am

I like everything I saw :)

I have some wishes though

I would like to be able to check or uncheck a box in the inspector so that that particular object is or isnt taken into account when using preset (connecting to each and everything that you want disgarded can get quite cluttered)

And also – will it be bossible to use old style lines? (sometimes I want just straigt lines)

#210482
Aug 25, 2011 at 9:28am

jesus. more tantalising info on max6 and already the top three posts contain 2 complaints/wishlist bullshitters.

could we not please just bask in the amazingness that that video portrays without the yappy children calling for “i want i want”?!

alersito is currently the most annoying member of forum / comments posts with his constant whining about multitouch crap.

this video is fantastic. the new features look amazing. i look forward to the next sneak peeks. thanks.

#210483
Aug 25, 2011 at 9:43am

…and relax.

I love how they’ve managed to combine the object list, autocomplete, reference and clue window into one feature. Bravo!

#210484
Aug 25, 2011 at 9:44am

Yeah Pid – Company´s hate customer feedback – they are always complaining about that

take a xanax or smoke a doobie buddy

#210485
Aug 25, 2011 at 11:27am

Its looks very nice – can’t wait to get my hands on :) Want to see more videos from Max 6 like the new code generation thing. Keep the good work!

#210486
Aug 25, 2011 at 11:55am

Pid i can ask them all i want. VVVV has native multitouch support for example. Why cant Max Msp? VVVV is free Max Msp not. And i will buy the next version of MAx. Then why i cant ask something like this?

REspects

#210487
Aug 25, 2011 at 12:00pm
#210488
Aug 25, 2011 at 12:08pm

Upss sorry edsonedge i put your name because i read your name. typical lapse.

sorry

Now my post its edited

#210489
Aug 25, 2011 at 2:13pm

I like the curved lines, but I also would like them to be straight at times. Hopefully there’s options for both.

Multitouch support should definitely be in the works, considering where interfaces are going these days, and considering how much Max (out of ANY application) could benefit from it…the possibilities are amazing. +1 that it’s coming someday soon.

C74 has been fantastic about listening to user feedback and requests, they have implemented a ton of them over the years, and I applaud that. They’re the ones who eventually decide whether a given request is worth the work, and sometimes I imagine it’s far more work than it might seem to us, for technical reasons we don’t understand.

And look at all the amazing new features which none of us saw coming!

#210490
Aug 25, 2011 at 2:32pm

I hope a other languages support for the help documentation. Spanish people are waiting for this.

#210491
Aug 25, 2011 at 4:26pm

max 6 = spooge

cant wait for this. looks set to be the max we always wanted.
looking forward to the reference window with everything else to really dig deep into ALL the objects and not just the ones i use now.

well done cycling ’74.

lewis

#210492
Aug 25, 2011 at 4:54pm

Thanks everyone for the feedback. Usability and discoverability are a huge focus in Max 6, and these are really just a sample of what we have planned.

#210493
Aug 25, 2011 at 6:47pm

What I see in this video seems to improves the ergonomics and the efficiency quite a lot when using Max and this is especially good for beginners – the teacher is writing.

Compatibility with multitouch would certainly be an interesting thing, but as multitouch is not deeply integrated neither in MacOS X and Windows, I think we’ll have to wait a bit for this. Maybe the next Apple thing will change this?

#210494
Aug 25, 2011 at 6:48pm

Multitouch does not enhance universal accessibility or inclusivity.

There.

I said it.

#210495
Aug 25, 2011 at 6:54pm

noob i have a multitouch screen with 2 touches and i would like to use with my own interface.

#210496
Aug 25, 2011 at 7:38pm

Hello Alersito,

Thank you for your feedback, however, I would like to be clear on the subject of multi-touch. We appreciate that you and several other users would like to see multi-touch support in Max, but we will not be addressing multi-touch support in Max 6. We will evaluate this along with other priorities for future releases, but we won’t be promising a date or any specific feature set.

We have many different priorities to balance, and in our opinion, this is not as high a priority as other areas we have been focusing on, which we think are of greater importance to the Max community as a whole.

We also won’t be responding in the forums to repeated requests for this feature, or further discussion on the subject. In general we will not be discussing feature requests, as our feature set is decided upon, and we need to remain focused on it so that we can get this great update in your hands later this year (and not a year from now). Already, I’ve probably spent more time on this message than I would have liked ;)

Please keep the great ideas and feedback coming. We do listen attentively to this, even if we aren’t able to accommodate everyone’s needs. It’s also a good way to share interest with third party developers in the community who might have the time and interest in specific users’ needs that we don’t have the resources to focus on at the expense of what we view as more important development.

Thank you for your understanding.

Sincerely,
Joshua

#210497
Aug 25, 2011 at 8:36pm

I’m really excited about Max 6. Great Sneak Peek, can’t wait to see more!!!

But I find it kind of sad that some people don’t appreciate the work that went in all the great new features. At least it looks this way when the first thing someone replies to a feature announcement is a feature request…

#210498
Aug 25, 2011 at 9:02pm

Andrew Benson is the Steve Jobs of Cycling, he always has that good shit…

Love the t-shirt!

#210499
Aug 25, 2011 at 9:31pm

I’m looking forward to MSP and Gen videos :)

#210500
Aug 25, 2011 at 9:46pm

“I’m looking forward to MSP and Gen videos”

YES :D

The announcement of Gen has gotten me rather excitable.

#210501
Aug 25, 2011 at 10:43pm

the complaining that some people have made reminds me of the time max 5 was announced and when it came out. sure there were thanks from very thankful users, but also many many MANY scornful remarks.
sadly these annoying remarks make it in first, and mostly for things that are not needed so much, or are not a top priority for the time being.

but i am totally looking forward to this next BIG step for max. and like max 5, it will have that windy start with some users, but will sure enough grab the masses the way cycling ’74 think it should. and for that, i respect. these guys know what there doing, just let them do it.

and a big ditto on the msp and gen shenanigans. sounds lush.

#210502
Aug 26, 2011 at 12:28am

I guess I just wish multitouch support was a lot easier to implement, no doubt that’s a problem with how it is in the OS…which is too bad. Really, it should be easily accessible, but apparently not. That’s OK, it’s still a few years out when the majority of Mac/Windows machines will support it, so there’s time.

Just started assisting in a Max class…watching the students work through the Max 5 tutorials is really interesting. I keep thinking about how much they’re taking for granted as compared to Max 4. “When I was your age…” !! And now, the next generation~ will be raised on 6. That’s fantastic…the pedagogical elements for learning look amazing. I can’t wait to fill in the many gaps in my own knowledge about objects: messages, attributes, related objects…all the info is already there, but having quicker and smarter access to it makes all the difference.

#210503
Aug 26, 2011 at 5:00am

As one of the first posters here I just want to assure the hissy fitters that I have nothing but respect for everything Cycling is doing – MaxMspJitter is my all time favorite program in the world and I would like to hug everyone who works on it individually, at the company and other external developers as well.

(fanboy enough for ya)

Kitty hug

#210504
Aug 26, 2011 at 8:11am

hi

i dont know if it’s mentioned above.

In OSX Lion the save function is disappearing . Personaly i think its a bad idea.
Understand that you have to go with the herd . But it would be nice to have some general preferences where you could choose to get the old save function back.

Also it would be nice to have an option in preferences which prevents max to startup with all previous opened patches after a crash.

-mj

#210505
Aug 26, 2011 at 9:06am

As a total noob Max 6 looks amazing. It’ll make things so much better, and easyer to understand. looking forward to it!

john.

#210506
Aug 26, 2011 at 1:28pm

Will patches created in Max 6 be compatible with Max 5 and vice versa?

#210507
Aug 26, 2011 at 2:35pm

@AntieJ yes, for the most part. We’re currently not disallowing opening Max 6 patchers in Max 5 but you’re likely to see a loss in functionality plus a few “no such object” errors, depending on the make up of the patch. Of course all Max 5 and Max 4 patchers will open fine in Max 6

-A

#210508
Aug 26, 2011 at 2:53pm

Very interesting stuff, I particularly like the discoverability features.

I’m curious as to how well it works for someone who doesn’t already know about a feature. For example, while users probably know about oscillators and so typing “osc….” will get you a long way, how can users discover “borax”, “drunk”, anal(!), funbuff, uzi and so forth.

I realize that such names are cute but they’re mostly non-obvious if not deliberately obfuscated. I mean, I get the reason for the name ‘drunk’, but wouldn’t it be better to call it RandomWalk?

Even in cases where I knew what I wanted, it was hard to find the appropriate object because of the name (or even determine whether there even WAS such an object). At one point, I needed functionality to block repeated values but ‘change’ did not come to mind as a synonym. I think it’s ambitious to assume that users will all be great at synonym guessing.

Anyway, I’m thoroughly enjoying my rennaissance with Max and looking forward to future versions.

#210509
Aug 26, 2011 at 5:38pm

Is it just me or does David Z. look alot like Iggy Pop here? :D

“I got a Lust for Life!”

#210510
Aug 26, 2011 at 5:52pm

I think that the name thing is a double-edged sword. I contend that while an oddball name might be harder to learn, it is easier to remember, and perhaps easier to type. For example, once you know what uzi or borax are, and what they do, they’re easy to remember (I pick those because they’re names I came up with.)

My hope is that the cross-referencing gets significantly beefed up in Max6. The “see also” database is a great idea, but it’s never been all that comprehensive. It really needs more connections / relations. Uzi should be related to counter, for example.

#210511
Aug 26, 2011 at 5:57pm

It’s not a question of learning. As you say, once you have found the object you’re fine. It’s finding them in the first place that’s tricky and some of that is due to the names.

Clearly multiple names can be used for objects, just like one can use ‘s’ or ‘send’ and so on and so it might be useful to have ‘meaningful’ names as well as the cute ones. However, I’m sure the Cycling74 people have thought about this so I was just curious to know if/how they have addressed it.

#210512
Aug 26, 2011 at 6:48pm

Hi dhjdhjdhj,
This is one of the big reasons behind the new, smarter auto-complete/search system. Hopefully, this feature will allow you to find what you are looking for without having to dig through tutorials or consulting your secret decoder ring.

#210513
Aug 26, 2011 at 7:11pm

There are max secret decoder rings!? WHY DID NOBODY TELL ME! Now I feel left out.

Slightly more seriously, that would be an awesome pre-order incentive.

#210514
Aug 26, 2011 at 10:55pm

yes—they let you unlock secret new messages, objects, and features…like an Easter egg hunt!

ok, well, I don’t really have one…though I’m sure we could patch one with [regexp]

#210515
Aug 27, 2011 at 1:36pm

As an educator, these new features are really great! The less time I need to spend teaching my students how Max works, and the more time I can spend teaching them DSP with Max, so much the better. (It’s a DSP class…)

Seriously, the documentation was good already, but this really improves things, especially the “what object does…” searching. I appreciate the emphasis on usability.

One question: with all the advanced search/find stuff, does find and replace in the patcher work? This would be great for demonstrations with multiple oscillators, etc.

#210516
Aug 27, 2011 at 4:42pm

i would like a help in spanish…. would be possible?

#210517
Aug 27, 2011 at 8:04pm

From what I can tell from the video, the new tools are amazing. My only remark is that there might be a widening gap between how much one can do with C objects as opposed to abstractions. Of course, I don’t know what Cycling ’74 has up their sleeves, but I would love to see similar tools for pattr-driven abstractions, and/or Java and JavaScript objects. I wonder whether that’s somethings the attrui (right spelling?) object David Z. mentioned will accomplish.

#210518

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