Forums > MaxMSP

MIDI interface question

May 13, 2008 | 4:43 pm

So I was at an electronics junk store and found what appears to be a midi interface for video editing – that was made in the 80′s. It’s called a JS/200 from a company called ETC! (Editing Technologies Corporation, INC).

The connections in the back consist of a quarter inch, a power button, a power adaptor plug and a midi jack. None of them have any labels so it’s more or less assumption telling me that the midi is midi out. The quarter inch jack I have no clue as to it’s function.

I have the midi jack plugged into a midi/usb cable and everytime i push a button, adjust a fader I get signal blinks from my Midi/usb cable. Problem is Max doesn’t show any midi input (using [midiin/midiinfo]). It shows the USB adaptor fine and I can select it but no midi info is coming in.

I open up ableton live and Live tells me that on certain buttons/faders/knobs it is getting midi information that it can use. However when I try to map it to something it won’t map.

I notice that for the buttons that I push, I get two blinks from my Midi/Usb cable. One blink when depressed and another when released. I don’t know if that helps, but I am super stumped and REALLY need a midi interface. I appreciate any help that you might be able to offer.

J



Eli
May 13, 2008 | 6:04 pm

Dear lord, look at the background:

http://members.aol.com/etcedit/

I don’t know much about old MIDI interfaces, since I wasn’t alive in the 80s, but the "buttons" that send a signal when depressed and pressed are toggles (but not the kind that stick), and are sending out a value of 127 when depressed, and a value of 0 when released. You could use them like you would modifier keys when you get the JS200 set up.

You may want to take your query to the Jitter forum, since this device was created to edit video, and maybe some oldtimer will come out of the woodwork who used a JS200 back in the day and help you.


May 13, 2008 | 8:50 pm

haha, the old timer coming out of the woodwork was exactly the person I’m trying to find.

Thanks for the info about the toggle’s. I can route the info to work like a regular button – if ever I could get the information beyond the usb midi cable and into max :P


May 13, 2008 | 9:39 pm

update – I updated the midi/usb cable drivers and am having better luck!

Now Max easily recieves MDID information!! problem is it doesn’t make any sense! haha

I get bits of information in groups of 3. Anytime I do something it comes in groups of three – like normal midi – except the numbers don’t make any sense… at all

This is what I get if I group the movement of a slider from (theoretically) 0 to 127

print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 7 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 192 28 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 63
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 192
print: 28 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 192 28
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 192 28 28
print: 0 0 192
print: 28 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 192 28
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 63 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 192 28 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 192
print: 28 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 63 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 192 28
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 192 28 28
print: 0 0 192
print: 28 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 7 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 192 28
print: 28 0 0
print: 60 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 56 0 0
print: 28 0 0
print: 192 28 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 60
print: 0 0 56
print: 0 0 63
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 28
print: 0 0 192
print: 28 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 60 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 56 0
print: 0 28 0
print: 0 28 0


May 13, 2008 | 9:54 pm

Hi,
From looking at the company website, and what you have told us so far, I’d wager that it is not even MIDI that is coming out of that box. Since the company (ETC) was building these custom hardware/software solutions for broadcast video producers, they would have no real incentive to create their hardware systems using something as general-purpose as MIDI. Most likely, they are using some kind of serial communication that your device and software is trying hard to understand as MIDI, but doesn’t quite conform to the same byte structure. This is all conjecture though, since I’ve never seen the gear in question. You are probably looking at a one-off device that was never meant to be used outside of the original context. However, if you are enterprising enough, you could try making a project of it, and find some way to parse the raw bytes coming down the pipe.

Or, if you give up with that, you can always just gut the thing and learn how to use a MIDItron/Arduino/Make-controller type of thing.

AB


May 13, 2008 | 10:42 pm

I thought it might be that earlier – but didn’t realize you could accomplish that with a MIDI cable… which I guess makes sense if it’s a closed proprietary system.

I thought about the arduino route as I’m currently trying to do the same with a foot controller but that would require…. 30 digital ins and 15 analog ins to get the whole board working. Who knows, I’m sure i’ll end up down that road but maybe something will come along that’s a little easier. right now my arduino is doing it’s best to not communicate with max :P


May 13, 2008 | 11:00 pm

i once went midi
ghetto< http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php/topic,6455.msg40285.html#msg40285>and
built a controller based on the midibox modules which i had left from
another project.
midibox is cheap, the community is patient/helpful and as its modular you
can pick and choose various combinations.

http://www.midibox.org
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/pixelpusher/midiController2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/pixelpusher/midi.jpg

On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 1:42 AM, Jhaysonn wrote:

>
> I thought it might be that earlier – but didn’t realize you could
> accomplish that with a MIDI cable… which I guess makes sense if it’s a
> closed proprietary system.
>
> I thought about the arduino route as I’m currently trying to do the same
> with a foot controller but that would require…. 30 digital ins and 15
> analog ins to get the whole board working. Who knows, I’m sure i’ll end up
> down that road but maybe something will come along that’s a little easier.
> right now my arduino is doing it’s best to not communicate with max :P
>
>


May 13, 2008 | 11:04 pm

http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php/topic,11387.0.html

On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 2:00 AM, yair reshef wrote:

> i once went midi ghetto< http://www.midibox.org/forum/index.php/topic,6455.msg40285.html#msg40285>and built a controller based on the midibox modules which i had left from
> another project.
> midibox is cheap, the community is patient/helpful and as its modular you
> can pick and choose various combinations.
>
>
http://www.midibox.org
> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/pixelpusher/midiController2.jpg
> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/pixelpusher/midi.jpg
>
>
>
> On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 1:42 AM, Jhaysonn wrote:
>
> >
> > I thought it might be that earlier – but didn’t realize you could
> > accomplish that with a MIDI cable… which I guess makes sense if it’s a
> > closed proprietary system.
> >
> > I thought about the arduino route as I’m currently trying to do the same
> > with a foot controller but that would require…. 30 digital ins and 15
> > analog ins to get the whole board working. Who knows, I’m sure i’ll end up
> > down that road but maybe something will come along that’s a little easier.
> > right now my arduino is doing it’s best to not communicate with max :P
> >
> >
>
>


May 14, 2008 | 11:33 am

Jhaysonn skrev:
> I thought it might be that earlier – but didn’t realize you could accomplish that with a MIDI cable… which I guess makes sense if it’s a closed proprietary system.
>
The 5-pin din (what you call the "midi cable") has historically been
used for all sorts of cabling – I had a radio once that used 5-pins to
connect to its speakers.
> I thought about the arduino route as I’m currently trying to do the same with a foot controller but that would require…. 30 digital ins and 15 analog ins to get the whole board working.
Are you completely sure you don’t just need to do multiplexing to get
what you want? The arduino site has some good info on that.
Andreas.


May 14, 2008 | 12:11 pm

Jhaysonn schrieb:
> So I was at an electronics junk store and found what appears to be a
> midi interface for video editing – that was made in the 80′s. It’s
> called a JS/200 from a company called ETC! (Editing Technologies
> Corporation, INC).

In the 80′s means its unlikely that it uses Midi.
The first keyboard on the market with a MIDI interface was the Prophet
600 by Sequential Circuits in 1983. The MMA was founded 1985…
Till it was even recognized by others than musical intrument makers took
quite a while…

ETC is not listed in the Manufacturers Id on the MMA Site:

http://www.midi.org/techspecs/manid.php

It is most certain that that 5 pin connector is something else than Midi…

Stefan


Stefan Tiedje————x——-
–_____———–|————–
–(_|_ —-|—–|—–()——-
– _|_)—-|—–()————–
———-()——–www.ccmix.com


May 15, 2008 | 1:22 pm

Ah, well thanks for pointing me in the right direction guys!

I liked what midibox seems to offer – it seemed a much cheaper alternative to arduino, if a bit less straightforward in terms of ‘what do I need" Thanks again guys – wish I could get it to work but.. oh well :P



Eli
May 15, 2008 | 2:09 pm

Could you take a picture of it? It would be nice to see.


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