Cycling 74 » Topic: MindWave to Max/MSP

MindWave to Max/MSP

Maurice Methot — Fri, 09 Mar 2012 16:54:10 +0000

MindWave is an inexpensive bio sensor product made by NeuroSky – has anyone developed a Max object to read the data from this sensor into Max? There is an object at nonpolynomials.com that seems to have been developed for another similar product made by the same company – but I cannot make it work with the MindWave EEG sensor. The suggested API’s for developing for the MindWave seem to be java or Flash – has anyone had any experience with this? I think I saw some people controlling the Euclidean Patter Generator at the Max Science Fair in Brooklyn last year – were they using some other EEG device? Any experience with the MindWave < --> Max/MSP connection would be most appreciated!

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

newdendrite — Sat, 10 Mar 2012 23:07:31 +0000

You might have seen the video of my EEG project from the first Max science fair in CA. At the time I was using one of the EEG amplifiers that I use in my clinical practice. It’s expensive (~$2500).

Since then I’ve experimented with two different NeuroSky headsets. The Mindwave headset works with the nonpolynomial Max Object but is more expensive and less convenient for the user. The Mindset headset uses a different baud rate and does not work correctly with that object.

During most of 2011, I was in frequent contact with NeuroSky and in occasional contact with nonpolynomial asking for an update. It should be a relatively easy fix. There were many promises but neither source produced an updated object. User support at NeuroSky is very slow, very poor and very uninformed. I finally gave up on them and on the NeuroSky products. Unless they work out of the box for the buyer, I wouldn’t recommend them.

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

Maurice Methot — Sun, 11 Mar 2012 14:11:50 +0000

thank you for the reply – much appreciated! Yes – so far I have had no luck with NeuroSky support – not a good sign! But in the meantime – although I downloaded the Max object from nonpolynomial.com, installed it as a Max external and the help file it comes with seems fine in a patcher – it still will not connect to the MindWave sensor – I may be wrong, but it seems designed for one of NeuroSky’s other sensors – the MindSet. My understanding is that the MindWave, less expensive than the MindSet, uses an RF dongle to communicate with the computer – and the object from nonpolynomial.com requires a bluetooth connection – which the mindwave sensor does not provide – but again – all naive speculation! Have you (or anyone) had any success with the mindWAVE and the nonpolynomial.com object?

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

newdendrite — Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:20:49 +0000

The Mindset is an older headset priced at about twice the cost of the newer Mindwave. The Mindset covers both ears with a padded headphones, which could be a plus or a minus, depending on how you want to use it. The user cannot hear ambient sound as well when wearing it. One of its connections depend on the headphone pad pressing an electrode against the ear. This can be result in unreliable input at times. The pluses of the Mindset are an internal rechargeable battery and Bluetooth with no dongle required. I have used it for performances and demo’s several times.

I have both the Mindset and the Mindwave. I can confirm that the Mindset does work with the nonpolynomial Max object as long as the physical connections to the user are maintained well. Knowing a bit about how to get and keep a clean EEG signal really helps.

In the past, I have been able to use the nonpolynominal to connect with the Mindwave, but the connection is unreliable and the data output is not correct. The problem with the nonpolynomial Max object is not the RF dongle vs. Bluetooth difference — it is the difference in baud rate for the data stream from the two devices.

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

Maurice Methot — Tue, 13 Mar 2012 12:53:26 +0000

Again – thanks so much for the help – I finally managed to get the MindWave to send data to the nonpolynomials object – I was initializing the port incorrectly – but yes, you are certainly correct – the data stream is unreliable and not very useful, and entirely different than what one sees in the mindwave visualizer app – and the problem does in fact seem the result of an difference in communication speed / device – to – device sync. I wonder if there is a way to tweak the object to reflect the difference in baud rate between the MindSet and the MindWave devices? Sounds like a question for the guy who wrote the object over at nonpolynomials – I’ll see if I can reach him – if I have any luck I will pass it on to this forum for future reference – again – THANK YOU!

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

bareimage — Tue, 13 Mar 2012 20:07:20 +0000

Okey, here is the truth, The device sends data at one second interval. You have to scale the data between these intervals. That is what happening with their brain visualizer. Try simple processing script that uses think gear connector.

That said I am currently using Mindset in the Museum installation and running into horrible problems with audio quality and can’t recommend moving to this unit for the sake of Audio output. Hell, the Emotive Sensor seems to look more interesting by the day

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

mat_kinotek — Sun, 07 Oct 2012 20:19:21 +0000

hey guys did you get any luck with the nonpolynomials object for max? Im using a MIndwave Mobile and max crashes everytime i try to launch the np_mindset object. Is there any way to change the baudrate of the object??
any hint si really appreciated!!
/m

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

genfu — Mon, 11 Mar 2013 11:30:42 +0000

Also interested in this, has there been any progression in getting the MindWave to work effectively in Max/MSP?

Re: MindWave to Max/MSP

efx — Thu, 14 Mar 2013 01:53:09 +0000

hello, I got the mindwave working with the nonpolynomial.com object. I paired my MIndWave with the general MindWave Manager and changed the input port to: port /dev/tty.MindWave in Max/Msp.
Now I get every 7 seconds a signal. Maybe its possible to decrease that delay, but I am very new to Max/Msp.