Vance Galloway

I have recently completed modifying a Max/MSP patch that I wrote long ago so that it would work in the latest version of Pluggo. I did this so that I could run the plugin in Live 6.0.1, which apparently requires Pluggo 3.6 (I was not able to run any of my older pluggo plugins in 6.0.1).

I am able to run all of the default new 3.6 pluggo plugins just fine.

By the way, I am on a G4 1.5Ghz powerbook (no intel machines here yet)

But I am having an odd problem that I suspect is somehow UB related: My patch works perfectly in that latest Max/MSP . But when I create a Pluggo version of it, I loose a very small set of the functionality of the patch. What SEEMS to be happening is that the external called "psw.list" by Peter Swinnin doesn't seem to be functioning within the Pluggo environment.

From what I have been able to tell, Peter has not created UB versions of this external.

But I'm a little baffled that the patch works just fine in Max and that it's only inside Live (my only VST host at the moment) that it doesn't work. It makes me wonder if it really IS a UB issue.

Of course, I can't really troubleshoot the problem easily once the pluggo plugin has been created.

Anyone have any clues or workarounds? Or other possible causes of an issue like this?

By the way - this same patch was working fine both in MAX/MSP 4.5 and as a pluggo using Pluggo 3.5

But I'm a little baffled that the patch works just fine in Max and that it's only inside Live (my only VST host at the moment) that it doesn't work.  It makes me wonder if it really IS a UB issue.

By the way - this same patch was working fine both in MAX/MSP 4.5 and as a pluggo using Pluggo 3.5


odd-issue-with-pluggo-in-live-6-0-1

> Anyone have any clues or workarounds? Or other possible causes of an

Maybe the CFM support doesn't work for pluggos?

This would be essential, that it works, but it might need to be 

installed somehow seperately. Don't know how though...

Maybe cycling can shade some light on it?

Vance Galloway wrote:
> Anyone have any clues or workarounds? Or other possible causes of an
> issue like this?

Maybe the CFM support doesn't work for pluggos?
This would be essential, that it works, but it might need to be 
installed somehow seperately. Don't know how though...

-- 
Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
--_____-----------|--------------
--(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
-- _|_)----|-----()--------------
----------()--------www.ccmix.com


Show us a stripped down patch using this object which also doesn't work.

I don't have a solution, but you bring up the interesting topic of troubleshooting Pluggos. It is certainly a tedious process. Open patch; make a small change; build pluggo; AU scan; open host; test; repeat. But, it is a process I have found necessary for every pluggo I've built.

Try to strip down the patch, aiming for it's functional core; simplify user interfaces, remove subpatches, etc. Perform incremental test until the problem goes away. Then build the patch back up until it comes back. Try to isolate the issue and construct a small patch with lots of flonum boxes level meters and maybe a print object that will fit in a single window -- no subpatches.

Open this in your host and you should be able to see where the signal path breaks down. It also gives something you can post to the forms.

> I don't have a solution, but you bring up the interesting topic of 

> troubleshooting Pluggos. It is certainly a tedious process. Open 

> patch; make a small change; build pluggo; AU scan; open host; test; 

> repeat. But, it is a process I have found necessary for every 

I tend to use Max/MSP to troubleshout my plugs. You can skip AUscan 

and open host, which are the most time consuming... there is still 

some issues that will need a host (plugsync~) but for most of it, it 

> I don't have a solution, but you bring up the interesting topic of  
> troubleshooting Pluggos. It is certainly a tedious process. Open  
> patch; make a small change; build pluggo; AU scan; open host; test;  
> repeat. But, it is a process I have found necessary for every  
> pluggo I've built.

I tend to use Max/MSP to troubleshout my plugs.  You can skip AUscan  
and open host, which are the most time consuming... there is still  
some issues that will need a host (plugsync~) but for most of it, it  
is fine.

No problem at all - This is pretty much as stripped down as it gets. This simple little patch works just fine in Max/MSP, but doesn't function as a pluggo within Live 6.0.1.

I have not been able to regress to using Live 5.x because this would reqire regressing my version of Pluggo...and if there's a way to get this functionality in the most recent versions (and I am sure there is) I'd like to go that route.

No problem at all - This is pretty much as stripped down as it gets. This simple little patch works just fine in Max/MSP, but doesn't function as a pluggo within Live 6.0.1. 

Can you please send me the object and your nth-random abstraction?

(I suppose I could have sent the previous posting as text, sorry!)

Quote: tremblap@gmail.com wrote on Thu, 26 October 2006 13:27

----------------------------------------------------

> I tend to use Max/MSP to troubleshout my plugs. You can skip AUscan 

> and open host, which are the most time consuming... there is still 

> some issues that will need a host (plugsync~) but for most of it, it 

Of course I troubleshoot in Max/MSP. If you've never encountered functional discrepancies between Max runtime and Pluggo runtime, either you are lucky or I am unlucky.

I'm not sure what you mean by skipping AUscan and open host, if I change and rebuild my Pluggo, I need to restart my host.

Quote: tremblap@gmail.com wrote on Thu, 26 October 2006 13:27
----------------------------------------------------
> I tend to use Max/MSP to troubleshout my plugs.  You can skip AUscan  
> and open host, which are the most time consuming... there is still  
> some issues that will need a host (plugsync~) but for most of it, it  
> is fine.
>
> pa
----------------------------------------------------

> Of course I troubleshoot in Max/MSP. If you've never encountered 

> functional discrepancies between Max runtime and Pluggo runtime, 

Not much more that I have not reported ;-)

Seriously, I do very basic stuff in Pluggo, mainly panning and 

distortion, so I have not encounter discrepancy between hosts.

> I'm not sure what you mean by skipping AUscan and open host, if I 

> change and rebuild my Pluggo, I need to restart my host.

Indeed, when used as AudioUnits. But I said that for the trouble 

shouting in Max. I tend to compile in the same folder than my patch, 

then use the plug message to vst~. No need to restart the host 

(which is MSP) Then it usually works in Logic and DP.

Sorry if I missunderstood your question, it was a long day.

> Of course I troubleshoot in Max/MSP. If you've never encountered  
> functional discrepancies between Max runtime and Pluggo runtime,  
> either you are lucky or I am unlucky.

Seriously, I do very basic stuff in Pluggo, mainly panning and  
distortion, so I have not encounter discrepancy between hosts.

> I'm not sure what you mean by skipping AUscan and open host, if I  
> change and rebuild my Pluggo, I need to restart my host.

Indeed, when used as AudioUnits.  But I said that for the trouble  
shouting in Max.  I tend to compile in the same folder than my patch,  
then use the plug message to vst~.  No need to restart the host  
(which is MSP)  Then it usually works in Logic and DP.

../Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/externals

The PSW external is in /Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/

So, it's working for you after you build it as a Pluggo pluin?

I hope I was clear in saying that it worked fine for me in Max, but not as a pluggo.

So, it's working for you after you build it as a Pluggo pluin?
I hope I was clear in saying that it worked fine for me in Max, but not as a pluggo.


Quote: Vance Galloway wrote on Thu, 26 October 2006 15:19

> The PSW external is in /Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/

> So, it's working for you after you build it as a Pluggo pluin?

> I hope I was clear in saying that it worked fine for me in Max, but not as a pluggo.

Correction: It is NOT in Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/ Externals

Instead, it was in a folder that I had specified in my File Prefrences.

When I place it in Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/ Externals and relaunch Max and open the patch I get the message "psw.list: No Such Object"

Quote: Vance Galloway wrote on Thu, 26 October 2006 15:19
----------------------------------------------------
> The PSW external is in /Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/
>
> So, it's working for you after you build it as a Pluggo pluin?
> I hope I was clear in saying that it worked fine for me in Max, but not as a pluggo.
----------------------------------------------------

Instead, it was in a folder that I had specified in my File Prefrences. 

When I place it in Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/ Externals and relaunch Max and open the patch I get the message "psw.list: No Such Object"


is for Pluggo when it runs in other hosts. It is not found inside of MaxMSP. Also when pluggo plugins run in MaxMSP, they use the MaxMSP C74 folder. In order to get around the problem of missing pluggo resources,

../Library/Application Support/C74 Plug-in Support/Pluggo Support

is added to the max search path when vst~ is fired up for the first time. The way I do it is put all extra stuff in there, ie

and just add it manually to the max search path anyway , so I don't have to wait until after firing up vst~ in order to develop plugs.

Thank you Andrew - That was the trick - I didn't have my external located in the righ folder for Pluggo to find it when Pluggo was being used in a third party host.

I'm never really clear on managing externals, I must admit. I'll try to wrap my head around the issue as a whole sometime soon because I'm sure I have mulitple copies of objects and externals that I shouldn't have multiple copies of.

Thanks again - Let's talk Fireface control sometime soon ;-)

Thanks again -  Let's talk Fireface control sometime soon ;-)

Odd issue with Pluggo in Live 6.0.1