[ot] max today, music tomorrow
Jul 23, 2006 at 2:39pm
[ot] max today, music tomorrow
The topic title explains what I want to say as a whole. I feel lost right now and don’t have anyone to rant to. I’ve been working with max for about 3 years now. In the past year its been almost an all day max fiasco trying to get a real composition environment that embraces quite a lot of different mediums and philosophies together. The problem is, well its still in shambles and that’s not because its unsolveable. No, the problem is its just a lot of work, and a lot of redundant grunt programming, and miscalculations here and there, and it goes on forever and ever.
I guess my question to the list is, how do you stay sane with Max and large projects? I used to play the piano a lot, and combose just what seems like basic stuff in Cubase way back when… Now it seems theres no time, the goal is to finish my Max patch so I can compose in a way that I feel is correct for me, yet, the price or cost of such a goal seems to mount higher and higher as “music” gets further away from me. I love Max to death but its defintely complicated my life and musical outlook to such a degree that I don’t feel I can cope with being able to support myself, work on my max stuff [which is really an endless list of things and improvements] and study general musicianship/classical composition all at the same time. I wish there was a solution, but with my main max patch still in pieces and essential parts yet to be built plus hardware yet unbought, I feel a victim of my own title to this topic… Is it always going to be Max today, music tomorrow, which leads to what? I thought Max was meant to liberate me, instead its put me in a world of cables and endless possibilities that seems to just stress me out and make it impossible to do what I set out to do, which is enjoy music.
Any advice would be appreciated,
Jul 23, 2006 at 2:50pm
Define your problem more narrowly. That is, find a way for Max to help with one small aspect of your piece. Then next time find a way for it to help with another. Over time you may build the uber-compositional system you’re dreaming of. But by then, your idea of the ideal system will probably be different than it is now.
My favorite part of Max, like other programming environments, is it’s ability to encapsulate. You begin patching together other people’s objects and abstractions–using other people’s work and words and ideas. But then as you aggregate them into your own objects and abstractions you find yourself using your own work and words and ideas more regularly. Start small and grow…
Jul 23, 2006 at 3:15pm
I can definitely see a bit of myself in your predicament, binez0r. Like Holland said, I think the problem is that your project started with a very wide and conceptual approach – this is where problems tend to arise, since there is no elegant way of going from concept->patch; every encapsulation you do will be a compromise of the original idea.
I too build many small problem-solvers, which are already starting to take the shape of a useful performance system. I also have a few standalones compiled along the way, which I can always dig out and use on their own.
The good thing for me, I guess, is that I don’t rely fully on Max for my music (yet), so I can always turn to my other system for when the actual music needs to get done.
Jul 23, 2006 at 4:57pm
On 23 Jul 2006, at 15:39, binez0r wrote:
Is the environment you’re building modular? Could you then create
I also think that no large patch is ever finished – I spent years
What am I trying to say? I guess it’s that, if there’s any way you
Jul 23, 2006 at 7:18pm
as they say in Marocco : ” un homme presse est un homme deja mort “
i understand your frustrations , i have them to once in a while .
i guess it is probably not a satisfying answer , and i did not come up with a patch for it but that is how i try to live my life now , with all the stuff i want to do ( become a taichi master , a herbalist, an installation artist, a political activist, a journalist, a musician , a wise man , a cat , a shapeshifter ,etc…o and still doing some Max once in a while…)
bonne journee ;)
Jul 24, 2006 at 3:21am
Your first mistake is assuming any of us are sane.
But, onward and upward. I think one key is modularity, which has been
More importantly, you have to change your design philsophy. Start with
The metric for development is that it takes 5 man/years to develop a
Jul 24, 2006 at 4:42am
Well, certainly in an insane world, only the sane seem insane to an insane person living in a sane world. Max certainly seems sane to me compared to a program like Cubase which seems insane, yet someone whos adament about using Cubase all day long would certainly look at building custom software as being insane with all of Cubase’s “features”… and so it loops into itself.
Plus, I know quite a few artists who would take being called insane as a compliment. I’m personally refering to “monkey mind”. I am after mental peace [piece, peach?]… AND max. So my new question is…
does anyone find mental peace working within Max?
Jul 24, 2006 at 5:15am
> does anyone find mental peace working within Max?
Yup. For what I have been doing lately, its easier for me (mentally) to
Trying to compose/produce/perform with other programs just stresses me
Jul 24, 2006 at 12:33pm
I believe that the issues you are raising, are some of what we aim at
- numerical representation
I have found these principles meaningful to consider when thinking about
One of the most important features of Jamoma in my mind is the framework
Jamoma is maintained using subversion at sourceforge.net. As we are
At the moment we are four developers actively submitting code to the
You can check out Jamoma here:
I would recommend trying to download from the repository instead of the
Jul 26, 2006 at 9:12am
Langdon Crawford wrote:
Nothing to add here, though the definition of “mental peace” might be
I certainly would find peace if I could patch all day and somebody else
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