q's: wii remote IR data

Dec 4, 2007 at 4:56am

q's: wii remote IR data

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/clips/wiimote-hack-is-wireless-multitouch-
tv-321329.php

I’m interested in implementing something in Max/MSP similar to the
finger tracking IR LED hack seen in the video above

doing a little research on wikipedia I find that:
- two IR sources (5 LED’s on either side) placed around 20cm apart
are used to triangulate a single position represented as XY coordinates
- hence only two values X & Y are received which represent the
position of the wii remote
- this assumes a moving wii remote and a stationary IR source — not
a stationary wii remote and a moving IR source

- my questions are:
is the XY coordinate data a limitation of the [app/object/
whatever] decoding the data coming from the wii remote?
in other words, is it possible to get data for multiple IR point
sources using the IR data coming from the wii remote?
obviously the wii remote *can* do this (its just a camera) since on
the ‘hack video’ there are multiple points on the wii screen
representing fingers reflecting the IR light coming off the LED array

any tips, tricks, suggestions?

#34884
Dec 4, 2007 at 5:39am

The wii remote isn’t being used to do the tracking. It is merely detecting the IR light. In that youtube video the guy was using some other software to track those IR points. You could use jit.findbounds or the cv.jit objects to pretty easily track the IR light picked up by the camera.

#118272
Dec 4, 2007 at 4:54pm

the problem is that OSCulator currently only sends XY triangulation data

On Dec 3, 2007, at 9:39 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> The wii remote isn’t being used to do the tracking. It is merely
> detecting the IR light. In that youtube video the guy was using
> some other software to track those IR points. You could use
> jit.findbounds or the cv.jit objects to pretty easily track the IR
> light picked up by the camera.

#118273
Dec 4, 2007 at 6:19pm

why don’t you try using aka.wiiremote object instead of osculator? It can draw the IR data onto a jit.lcd

#118274
Dec 4, 2007 at 6:44pm

because I’m working on a G4 laptop and there’s a problem with the
[aka.wiiremote] object passing IR data
I’ve contacted Masayuki-san and he says he has been unable track down
the bug in his code

besides, I think [aka.wiiremote] only passes X, Y, angle (radians)
and tracking data for a single point – is this not the case?

but until Masayuki is able to fix this I’m using OSCulator for my
project
and Camille (the developer for OSCulator) is willing to make data for
four IR points available in basic mode on an upcoming release

http://wiibrew.org/index.php?title=Wiimote#IR_Camera

I’m begging him to implement ‘extended’ mode so I can also get a
value for the size of each IR point

On Dec 4, 2007, at 10:19 AM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> why don’t you try using aka.wiiremote object instead of osculator?
> It can draw the IR data onto a jit.lcd

#118275
Dec 4, 2007 at 9:36pm

I guess I should have looked before I leapt. You are right about aka.wiiremote only passing xy and angle. I haven’t actually used the wiiremote in any projects so I should have been more careful with my response.

Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 10:44
—————————————————-
> because I’m working on a G4 laptop and there’s a problem with the
> [aka.wiiremote] object passing IR data
> I’ve contacted Masayuki-san and he says he has been unable track down
> the bug in his code
>
> besides, I think [aka.wiiremote] only passes X, Y, angle (radians)
> and tracking data for a single point – is this not the case?
>
> but until Masayuki is able to fix this I’m using OSCulator for my
> project
> and Camille (the developer for OSCulator) is willing to make data for
> four IR points available in basic mode on an upcoming release
> http://wiibrew.org/index.php?title=Wiimote#IR_Camera
>
> I’m begging him to implement ‘extended’ mode so I can also get a
> value for the size of each IR point
>
>
>
>
> On Dec 4, 2007, at 10:19 AM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
>
> >
> > why don’t you try using aka.wiiremote object instead of osculator?
> > It can draw the IR data onto a jit.lcd
>
>
>
>
—————————————————-

#118276
Dec 4, 2007 at 9:42pm

no worries…I wish it was as easy it you made it sound! ;)

On Dec 4, 2007, at 1:36 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> I guess I should have looked before I leapt. You are right about
> aka.wiiremote only passing xy and angle. I haven’t actually used
> the wiiremote in any projects so I should have been more careful
> with my response.
>
> Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 10:44
> —————————————————-
>> because I’m working on a G4 laptop and there’s a problem with the
>> [aka.wiiremote] object passing IR data
>> I’ve contacted Masayuki-san and he says he has been unable track down
>> the bug in his code
>>
>> besides, I think [aka.wiiremote] only passes X, Y, angle (radians)
>> and tracking data for a single point – is this not the case?
>>
>> but until Masayuki is able to fix this I’m using OSCulator for my
>> project
>> and Camille (the developer for OSCulator) is willing to make data for
>> four IR points available in basic mode on an upcoming release
>> http://wiibrew.org/index.php?title=Wiimote#IR_Camera
>>
>> I’m begging him to implement ‘extended’ mode so I can also get a
>> value for the size of each IR point
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 4, 2007, at 10:19 AM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> why don’t you try using aka.wiiremote object instead of osculator?
>>> It can draw the IR data onto a jit.lcd
>>
>>
>>
>>
> —————————————————-
>
>

#118277
Dec 4, 2007 at 9:47pm

I’m curious why you decided to use the wii controller for your project. It would be really simple if you bought a cheap IR camera and used the cv.jit objects. Are you using features other than the IR camera in the wiiremote?

#118278
Dec 4, 2007 at 11:24pm

well the wii remote cost me $35 — and none of the IR cameras I found
have bluetooth
unless I’m not looking in the right place…maybe you know of one
with bluetooth that is < $35?
plus the wii remote has all the other features which could be used if
so desired
especially for a dance project

On Dec 4, 2007, at 1:47 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> I’m curious why you decided to use the wii controller for your
> project. It would be really simple if you bought a cheap IR camera
> and used the cv.jit objects. Are you using features other than the
> IR camera in the wiiremote?

#118279
Dec 5, 2007 at 12:26am

Ahh. You require bluetooth. I know someone who found a IR camera which cost $45 but it definitely does not use bluetooth. I guess your best bet would be to wait for those updates to OSCulator.

Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 15:24
—————————————————-
> well the wii remote cost me $35 — and none of the IR cameras I found
> have bluetooth
> unless I’m not looking in the right place…maybe you know of one
> with bluetooth that is < $35?
> plus the wii remote has all the other features which could be used if
> so desired
> especially for a dance project
>
>
>
> On Dec 4, 2007, at 1:47 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
>
> >
> > I’m curious why you decided to use the wii controller for your
> > project. It would be really simple if you bought a cheap IR camera
> > and used the cv.jit objects. Are you using features other than the
> > IR camera in the wiiremote?
>
>
—————————————————-

#118280
Dec 5, 2007 at 12:41am

can you explain 2 things?.

1) the Osculator reports X and Y of just one point?

2) you are able to use the datas, from aka patch or Osculator, from the IR camera? In my case they are too much noisy or strange or sometimes….Nonexistent……

thank,s

L.

#118281
Dec 5, 2007 at 1:42am

On Dec 4, 2007, at 4:41 PM, lorbi wrote:

>
> can you explain 2 things?.
>
> 1) the Osculator reports X and Y of just one point?
no — OSCulator passes (x,y) coords which represents the
triangulation data of the camera itself relative to two IR sources
you can use two candles spaced at ~20cm apart to test this
OSCulator passes the data via port 8000 or whatever port you want to use
which you then pick up with a [udpreceive] object in Max

>
>
> 2) you are able to use the datas, from aka patch or Osculator, from
> the IR camera?
no not the aka patch

wiiremote->OSCulator->Max

> In my case they are too much noisy or strange or
> sometimes….Nonexistent……
>
>
> thank,s
>
> L.
>
>
>
>
>
>

#118282
Dec 5, 2007 at 1:45am

FYI: you can also hack a webcam to be infrared:
http://www.hoagieshouse.com/IR/
but it still needs to be tethered via USB
and it doesn’t give you accel data
:(

On Dec 4, 2007, at 4:26 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> Ahh. You require bluetooth. I know someone who found a IR camera
> which cost $45 but it definitely does not use bluetooth. I guess
> your best bet would be to wait for those updates to OSCulator.
>
> Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 15:24
> —————————————————-
>> well the wii remote cost me $35 — and none of the IR cameras I found
>> have bluetooth
>> unless I’m not looking in the right place…maybe you know of one
>> with bluetooth that is < $35?
>> plus the wii remote has all the other features which could be used if
>> so desired
>> especially for a dance project
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 4, 2007, at 1:47 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I’m curious why you decided to use the wii controller for your
>>> project. It would be really simple if you bought a cheap IR camera
>>> and used the cv.jit objects. Are you using features other than the
>>> IR camera in the wiiremote?
>>
>>
> —————————————————-
>
>

#118283
Dec 5, 2007 at 2:24am

If you have the XY coords of a point you can easily measure rate of change as explained by a bunch of people in this thread:

http://www.cycling74.com/forums/index.php?t=msg&goto=120998&rid=0&srch=rate+of+change#msg_120992

Or do you mean the tilt data from the wiiremote accelerometers?

Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 17:45
—————————————————-
> FYI: you can also hack a webcam to be infrared:
> http://www.hoagieshouse.com/IR/
> but it still needs to be tethered via USB
> and it doesn’t give you accel data
> :(
>
>
> On Dec 4, 2007, at 4:26 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
>
> >
> > Ahh. You require bluetooth. I know someone who found a IR camera
> > which cost $45 but it definitely does not use bluetooth. I guess
> > your best bet would be to wait for those updates to OSCulator.
> >
> > Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 15:24
> > —————————————————-
> >> well the wii remote cost me $35 — and none of the IR cameras I found
> >> have bluetooth
> >> unless I’m not looking in the right place…maybe you know of one
> >> with bluetooth that is < $35?
> >> plus the wii remote has all the other features which could be used if
> >> so desired
> >> especially for a dance project
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Dec 4, 2007, at 1:47 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> I’m curious why you decided to use the wii controller for your
> >>> project. It would be really simple if you bought a cheap IR camera
> >>> and used the cv.jit objects. Are you using features other than the
> >>> IR camera in the wiiremote?
> >>
> >>
> > —————————————————-
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
—————————————————-

#118284
Dec 5, 2007 at 3:09am

On Dec 4, 2007, at 6:24 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> If you have the XY coords of a point you can easily measure rate of
> change as explained by a bunch of people in this thread:
> http://www.cycling74.com/forums/index.php?
> t=msg&goto=120998&rid=0&srch=rate+of+change#msg_120992
yup I know this thanks

>
> Or do you mean the tilt data from the wiiremote accelerometers?
yes that is what I meant — sorry should have been more clear…

#118285
Dec 5, 2007 at 2:21pm

what’s extremely annoying about this video is that the multi-blob
video he’s getting is actually coming from the wii running in setup
mode!

he’s using a $250 game console to get those two touch blobs.

On Dec 4, 2007, at 4:36 PM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:

>
> I guess I should have looked before I leapt. You are right about
> aka.wiiremote only passing xy and angle. I haven’t actually used the
> wiiremote in any projects so I should have been more careful with my
> response.
>
> Quote: Kim Cascone wrote on Tue, 04 December 2007 10:44
> —————————————————-
>> because I’m working on a G4 laptop and there’s a problem with the
>> [aka.wiiremote] object passing IR data
>> I’ve contacted Masayuki-san and he says he has been unable track down
>> the bug in his code
>>
>> besides, I think [aka.wiiremote] only passes X, Y, angle (radians)
>> and tracking data for a single point – is this not the case?
>>
>> but until Masayuki is able to fix this I’m using OSCulator for my
>> project
>> and Camille (the developer for OSCulator) is willing to make data for
>> four IR points available in basic mode on an upcoming release
>> http://wiibrew.org/index.php?title=Wiimote#IR_Camera
>>
>> I’m begging him to implement ‘extended’ mode so I can also get a
>> value for the size of each IR point
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 4, 2007, at 10:19 AM, Solomon Bothwell wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> why don’t you try using aka.wiiremote object instead of osculator?
>>> It can draw the IR data onto a jit.lcd
>>
>>
>>
>>
> —————————————————-
>
>
>

#118286
Dec 6, 2007 at 12:56am

Quote: joshua goldberg wrote on Wed, 05 December 2007 15:21
—————————————————-
> what’s extremely annoying about this video is that the multi-blob
> video he’s getting is actually coming from the wii running in setup
> mode!
>

what does it mean “set up” mode?

i got only the wiimote without console, that’s why i don’t understand…i hope :)

L.

#118287
Dec 6, 2007 at 1:55am

I assume its a calibration mode for getting the remote synced with the system. It looks like in setup mode the remote is used as an infrared camera for picking up the IR LED bar data from box ontop of the TV. This is the mode Kim Cascone needs the remote to be in if he wants to use the camera as such.

Quote: lorbi wrote on Wed, 05 December 2007 16:56
—————————————————-
> Quote: joshua goldberg wrote on Wed, 05 December 2007 15:21
> —————————————————-
> > what’s extremely annoying about this video is that the multi-blob
> > video he’s getting is actually coming from the wii running in setup
> > mode!
> >
>
>
> what does it mean “set up” mode?
>
> i got only the wiimote without console, that’s why i don’t understand…i hope :)
>
>
> L.
—————————————————-

#118288

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