Cheng Chien-Wen

I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.

For myself, I use audiotrak prodigy 192 soundcard with my PC, and the audio driver never works well with Max/MSP if I need to run some CPU consuming patch. In other words, Max/MSP crashes quite often on my PC.

So I have no idea about how stable a "normal" pc laptop can be. Could any one share your experiences with me about the stability of PC running Max/MSP ?

Please also indicate the model name and audio interface you use if you are willing to share your experiences using PC laptop for Max/MSP.

Hi,
I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.

questions-for-pc-users

MaxMSP is one of the most stable software on my PCs (desktop and 

laptops). Crashes oftenly appear when *you* do something wrong or when 

you use 3rd party externals that are not stable. I use it on stage since 

it is available for Windows and it has only crashed once (last night...)

The old struggle (Mac = for pro, Windows = bullshit) is osbolete. The 

real problem with a PC is how you use it and how you set it up. Main 

troubles come from Antiviruses (low your performances a lot), Firewalls, 

tiny apps running in background and so on. But a fresh laptop with only 

the essential gear installed and which is forbidden to go on internet 

will be a perfect companion for music creation.

ProTools runs fine (if you still need to use this s**t), Cubase SX2 or 3 

is amazingly powerfull, Sound Forge is a legendary audio editing tool 

that kicks everything and we got a lot of fine plugins too.

> I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.

> For myself, I use audiotrak prodigy 192 soundcard with my PC, and the audio driver never works well with Max/MSP if I need to run some CPU consuming patch. In other words, Max/MSP crashes quite often on my PC.

> So I have no idea about how stable a "normal" pc laptop can be. Could any one share your experiences with me about the stability of PC running Max/MSP ?

> Please also indicate the model name and audio interface you use if you are willing to share your experiences using PC laptop for Max/MSP.

MaxMSP is one of the most stable software on my PCs (desktop and 
laptops). Crashes oftenly appear when *you* do something wrong or when 
you use 3rd party externals that are not stable. I use it on stage since 
it is available for Windows and it has only crashed once (last night...)

The old struggle (Mac = for pro, Windows = bullshit) is osbolete. The 
real problem with a PC is how you use it and how you set it up. Main 
troubles come from Antiviruses (low your performances a lot), Firewalls, 
tiny apps running in background and so on. But a fresh laptop with only 
the essential gear installed and which is forbidden to go on internet 
will be a perfect companion for music creation.

ProTools runs fine (if you still need to use this s**t), Cubase SX2 or 3 
is amazingly powerfull, Sound Forge is a legendary audio editing tool 
that kicks everything and we got a lot of fine plugins too.

Cheng Chien-Wen wrote:
> Hi,
> I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.
>
> For myself, I use audiotrak prodigy 192 soundcard with my PC, and the audio driver never works well with Max/MSP if I need to run some CPU consuming patch. In other words, Max/MSP crashes quite often on my PC.
>
> So I have no idea about how stable a "normal" pc laptop can be. Could any one share your experiences with me about the stability of PC running Max/MSP ?
>
> Please also indicate the model name and audio interface you use if you are willing to share your experiences using PC laptop for Max/MSP.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Chien-Wen
>
>
>


Could you also let me know the audio interface and the laptop you use ?

Quote: Cheng Chien-Wen wrote on Thu, 05 October 2006 01:19

----------------------------------------------------

Quote: Cheng Chien-Wen wrote on Thu, 05 October 2006 01:19
----------------------------------------------------
> Hi,
> I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.
>
> For myself, I use audiotrak prodigy 192 soundcard with my PC, and the audio driver never works well with Max/MSP if I need to run some CPU consuming patch. In other words, Max/MSP crashes quite often on my PC.
>
> So I have no idea about how stable a "normal" pc laptop can be. Could any one share your experiences with me about the stability of PC running Max/MSP ?
>
> Please also indicate the model name and audio interface you use if you are willing to share your experiences using PC laptop for Max/MSP.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Chien-Wen
>
----------------------------------------------------


Sure : RME Hammerfall Multiface & Digiface (Cardbus interface), of 

> Could you also let me know the audio interface you use ?

> Quote: Cheng Chien-Wen wrote on Thu, 05 October 2006 01:19

> ----------------------------------------------------

>> I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.

>> For myself, I use audiotrak prodigy 192 soundcard with my PC, and the audio driver never works well with Max/MSP if I need to run some CPU consuming patch. In other words, Max/MSP crashes quite often on my PC.

>> So I have no idea about how stable a "normal" pc laptop can be. Could any one share your experiences with me about the stability of PC running Max/MSP ?

>> Please also indicate the model name and audio interface you use if you are willing to share your experiences using PC laptop for Max/MSP.

Sure : RME Hammerfall Multiface & Digiface (Cardbus interface), of 
course ;-)

Cheng Chien-Wen wrote:
> Could you also let me know the audio interface you use ?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Quote: Cheng Chien-Wen wrote on Thu, 05 October 2006 01:19
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
>> Hi,
>> I would like to know how PC users think about the stability of using Max/MSP on PC laptop. I know Mac is very stable but currently I think it is not worth it to buy core (1) macbook pro when core (2) should be on the market.
>>
>> For myself, I use audiotrak prodigy 192 soundcard with my PC, and the audio driver never works well with Max/MSP if I need to run some CPU consuming patch. In other words, Max/MSP crashes quite often on my PC.
>>
>> So I have no idea about how stable a "normal" pc laptop can be. Could any one share your experiences with me about the stability of PC running Max/MSP ?
>>
>> Please also indicate the model name and audio interface you use if you are willing to share your experiences using PC laptop for Max/MSP.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Chien-Wen
>>
>>
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>


Subject: Re: [maxmsp] Questions for PC users

> MaxMSP is one of the most stable software on my PCs (desktop and

> laptops). Crashes oftenly appear when *you* do something wrong or when

> you use 3rd party externals that are not stable. I use it on stage since

> it is available for Windows and it has only crashed once (last night...)

> The old struggle (Mac = for pro, Windows = bullshit) is osbolete. The

> real problem with a PC is how you use it and how you set it up. Main

> troubles come from Antiviruses (low your performances a lot), Firewalls,

> tiny apps running in background and so on. But a fresh laptop with only

> the essential gear installed and which is forbidden to go on internet

> will be a perfect companion for music creation.

> ProTools runs fine (if you still need to use this s**t), Cubase SX2 or 3

> is amazingly powerfull, Sound Forge is a legendary audio editing tool

> that kicks everything and we got a lot of fine plugins too.

I've been using MaxMsp under WinXP SP2 optimized for audio (AMD 3200+, 1Gb 

ram, 160Gb 7200rpm HD, high quality 128mb video card) and a RME Fireface 800 

I've also worked with a Powerbook G4 1 Ghz (1.8 Gb ram) and a Titanium G3 

(800 mhz, 1Gb ram), and my patches worked much better on Macs than on my Pc.

Some complex Patches I've built worked ok with the integrated audio card of 

my pc, but didn't work when using RME firewire card (I tried also with a 

Motu 828MkII but same results) there are glitches, buffer unsync and CPU 

load overs. I tried these patches on different Macs and they run flawlessly 

on them (without any need to use a bigger buffer size).

I think that this happened because Macs are built better for Audio 

applications. Firewire is much better integrated into Macs (performs more 

efficently, and there's no need for high buffer sizes), and OsX requires 

That's why, I think, everytime I go to a concert (electroacoustic 

contemporary music, computer music, not commercial stuff) I see people using 

Max Msp with Macs (G5 and Powerbooks) instead of Pcs.

And that's way I'm going to buy a Mac Pro, even though I'd prefer to stay 

with Pcs (which I know very well, after years of work with them).

When using Max Msp, Macs perform better. Moreover, there is a lot of 

software for electroacoustic music that runs only on Macs (Supercollider, 

Pcs are faster and better for audio editing and other stuff, but with Max... 

I'd like to hear any opinion about what I have found out.

By the way, RME cards work Great!! both on older Macs than on newer 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "f.e" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 4:38 PM
Subject: Re: [maxmsp] Questions for PC users

> MaxMSP is one of the most stable software on my PCs (desktop and
> laptops). Crashes oftenly appear when *you* do something wrong or when
> you use 3rd party externals that are not stable. I use it on stage since
> it is available for Windows and it has only crashed once (last night...)
>
> The old struggle (Mac = for pro, Windows = bullshit) is osbolete. The
> real problem with a PC is how you use it and how you set it up. Main
> troubles come from Antiviruses (low your performances a lot), Firewalls,
> tiny apps running in background and so on. But a fresh laptop with only
> the essential gear installed and which is forbidden to go on internet
> will be a perfect companion for music creation.
>
> ProTools runs fine (if you still need to use this s**t), Cubase SX2 or 3
> is amazingly powerfull, Sound Forge is a legendary audio editing tool
> that kicks everything and we got a lot of fine plugins too.
>
> best
>
> f.e

I've been using MaxMsp under WinXP SP2 optimized for audio (AMD 3200+, 1Gb 
ram, 160Gb 7200rpm HD, high quality 128mb video card) and a RME Fireface 800 
firewird audiocard for two years.
I've also worked with a Powerbook G4 1 Ghz (1.8 Gb ram) and a Titanium G3 
(800 mhz, 1Gb ram), and my patches worked much better on Macs than on my Pc.
Some complex Patches I've built worked ok with the integrated audio card of 
my pc, but didn't work when using RME firewire card (I tried also with a 
Motu 828MkII but same results) there are glitches, buffer unsync and CPU 
load overs. I tried these patches on different Macs and they run flawlessly 
on them (without any need to use a bigger buffer size).
I think that this happened because Macs are built better for Audio 
applications. Firewire is much better integrated into Macs (performs more 
efficently, and there's no need for high buffer sizes), and OsX requires 
quite less resources than WinXP.
That's why, I think, everytime I go to a concert (electroacoustic 
contemporary music, computer music, not commercial stuff) I see people using 
Max Msp with Macs (G5 and Powerbooks) instead of Pcs.
And that's way I'm going to buy a Mac Pro, even though I'd prefer to stay 
with Pcs (which I know very well, after years of work with them).
When using Max Msp, Macs perform better. Moreover, there is a lot of 
software for electroacoustic music that runs only on Macs (Supercollider, 
for example).
Pcs are faster and better for audio editing and other stuff, but with Max... 
this is my experience.
I'd like to hear any opinion about what I have found out.
By the way, RME cards work Great!! both on older Macs than on newer 
MacIntels! (and PCs, obviously)

On 06.10.2006, at 17:48, Carlo Laurenzi wrote:

> Moreover, there is a lot of software for electroacoustic music that 

> runs only on Macs (Supercollider, for example).

update your facts. sc has been running just fine under both windows 

fredrikolofsson.com klippav.org musicalfieldsforever.com

On 06.10.2006, at 17:48, Carlo Laurenzi wrote:
> Moreover, there is a lot of software for electroacoustic music that 
> runs only on Macs (Supercollider, for example).

update your facts.  sc has been running just fine under both windows 
and linux for quite some time.
http://sonenvir.at/downloads/sc3/
_f

   #|
      fredrikolofsson.com     klippav.org     musicalfieldsforever.com
   |#


... as always : mac is for serious people (command prompt for audio 

rendering). We, Punks, use Windows with CoolEdit for live performances, 

that's well known, but we sure don't have to hide an apple under a large 

> On 06.10.2006, at 17:48, Carlo Laurenzi wrote:

>> Moreover, there is a lot of software for electroacoustic music that 

>> runs only on Macs (Supercollider, for example).

> update your facts. sc has been running just fine under both windows 

> fredrikolofsson.com klippav.org musicalfieldsforever.com

... as always : mac is for serious people (command prompt for audio 
rendering). We, Punks, use Windows with CoolEdit for live performances, 
that's well known, but we sure don't have to hide an apple under a large 
black tape...

Fredrik Olofsson wrote:
>
> On 06.10.2006, at 17:48, Carlo Laurenzi wrote:
>> Moreover, there is a lot of software for electroacoustic music that 
>> runs only on Macs (Supercollider, for example).
>
> update your facts.  sc has been running just fine under both windows 
> and linux for quite some time.
> http://sonenvir.at/downloads/sc3/
> _f
>
>
>   #|
>      fredrikolofsson.com     klippav.org     musicalfieldsforever.com
>   |#
>
>


Hey, this is a very good news for me! Thanks!

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Fredrik Olofsson" 
To: 
Sent: Friday, October 06, 2006 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [maxmsp] Questions for PC users

> update your facts.  sc has been running just fine under both windows 
> and linux for quite some time.
> http://sonenvir.at/downloads/sc3/
> _f
>
>
>   #|
>      fredrikolofsson.com     klippav.org     musicalfieldsforever.com
>   |#
>

Hey, this is a very good news for me! Thanks!
I'll try it immediately.

> I've been using MaxMsp under WinXP SP2 optimized for audio (AMD 3200+, 

> 1Gb ram, 160Gb 7200rpm HD, high quality 128mb video card) and a RME 

> Fireface 800 firewird audiocard for two years.

> I've also worked with a Powerbook G4 1 Ghz (1.8 Gb ram) and a Titanium 

> G3 (800 mhz, 1Gb ram), and my patches worked much better on Macs than on 

Have you explored the possibility of using a different Firewire 

interface on the PC? The RME news server is filled with sob stories and 

associated recommendations for Firewire interfaces. The Mac interface 

[And to the great-grandparent post: RME HDSP Multiface works beautifully 

using either my Cardbus/WinXP (Pentium M) or PCI/OSX (G4).]

Carlo Laurenzi wrote:
> I've been using MaxMsp under WinXP SP2 optimized for audio (AMD 3200+, 
> 1Gb ram, 160Gb 7200rpm HD, high quality 128mb video card) and a RME 
> Fireface 800 firewird audiocard for two years.
> I've also worked with a Powerbook G4 1 Ghz (1.8 Gb ram) and a Titanium 
> G3 (800 mhz, 1Gb ram), and my patches worked much better on Macs than on 
> my Pc.

Have you explored the possibility of using a different Firewire 
interface on the PC?  The RME news server is filled with sob stories and 
associated recommendations for Firewire interfaces.  The Mac interface 
seems not to have problems.

[And to the great-grandparent post: RME HDSP Multiface works beautifully 
using either my Cardbus/WinXP (Pentium M) or PCI/OSX (G4).]


>> I've been using MaxMsp under WinXP SP2 optimized for audio (AMD 3200+, 

>> 1Gb ram, 160Gb 7200rpm HD, high quality 128mb video card) and a RME 

>> Fireface 800 firewird audiocard for two years.

>> I've also worked with a Powerbook G4 1 Ghz (1.8 Gb ram) and a Titanium G3 

>> (800 mhz, 1Gb ram), and my patches worked much better on Macs than on my 

> Have you explored the possibility of using a different Firewire interface 

> on the PC? The RME news server is filled with sob stories and associated 

> recommendations for Firewire interfaces. The Mac interface seems not to 

Well, I think the firewire interface on my Asus A8N Sli Deluxe is good 

because I tried my patches on several other PCs and I had the same results, 

Anyway, I always experienced audio stuttering and CPU going over 100% after 

hitting stop on a patch running 7 groove~ objects. when I reset the buffer 

size, even at the same value I was using before, audio gets back in sync and 

This did never happened on any Mac I worked with.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "dlurk" 
To: 
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2006 3:24 AM
Subject: Re: [maxmsp] Questions for PC users

>
>
> Carlo Laurenzi wrote:
>> I've been using MaxMsp under WinXP SP2 optimized for audio (AMD 3200+, 
>> 1Gb ram, 160Gb 7200rpm HD, high quality 128mb video card) and a RME 
>> Fireface 800 firewird audiocard for two years.
>> I've also worked with a Powerbook G4 1 Ghz (1.8 Gb ram) and a Titanium G3 
>> (800 mhz, 1Gb ram), and my patches worked much better on Macs than on my 
>> Pc.
>
> Have you explored the possibility of using a different Firewire interface 
> on the PC?  The RME news server is filled with sob stories and associated 
> recommendations for Firewire interfaces.  The Mac interface seems not to 
> have problems.
>

Well, I think the firewire interface on my Asus A8N Sli Deluxe is good 
because I tried my patches on several other PCs and I had the same results, 
even worse sometimes.
Anyway, I always experienced audio stuttering and CPU going over 100% after 
hitting stop on a patch running 7 groove~ objects. when I reset the buffer 
size, even at the same value I was using before, audio gets back in sync and 
cpu goes under 20% usage.
This did never happened on any Mac I worked with.

Would you share a patch that might demonstrate this on a PC? If it were to run flawlessly on mine or if someone were to discover an XP-specific bug, etc....

Subject: [maxmsp] Re: Questions for PC users

> Would you share a patch that might demonstrate this on a PC? If it were to 

> run flawlessly on mine or if someone were to discover an XP-specific bug, 

I just want to take away some parts of the patch which are not involved in 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "matt" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2006 1:49 AM
Subject: [maxmsp] Re: Questions for PC users

>
> Would you share a patch that might demonstrate this on a PC? If it were to 
> run flawlessly on mine or if someone were to discover an XP-specific bug, 
> etc....
>

I will. Maybe tomorrow.
I just want to take away some parts of the patch which are not involved in 
causing the problem.