Forums > Jitter

v001 Shaders Beta

July 4, 2007 | 11:23 pm

Hello

Id like to announce the beta release of some shaders Ive been working
on.

You can read all about them here:

http://001.vade.info/?p=18

or just download them here:

http://001.vade.info/v001/downloads/v001ShadersB1.zip

Id love some feedback, i expect some rough edges, so feel free to
contact me off list for any suggestions, complaints,
incompatibilities or issues.

Ive only tested these shaders on OS X on a few machines, so id be
curious of XP support, but ive followed some pretty loose guidelines
to keep things as compatible and fast as possible.

Thanks. I plan on releasing shaders every so often, and id love to
know what people need/want shader wise. Im looking to create a pretty
decently large library of useful, consistent and fast shaders. If you
are interested in helping out, please chime in and speak up.

Thanks.

v a d e //

http://www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info


July 4, 2007 | 11:43 pm

Nice work vade. A few initial coments:

Could you add an esc key -> fullscreen to the patches?

Also, any built-in GLSL noise functions are not going to run on the
GPU since no GPU actually supports them. The faster solution is to
pass in a buffer of noise and a buffer of indices. In a vertex shader
this would be a const array of noise declared in the shader (since
most cards don’t support textures in the vertex shader right now) and
a matrix of indices which could be passed in through one of
jit.gl.mesh’s inlets or by one of the model’s per-vertex parameters.
See vd.gnoise.3d.jxs for an example.

wes

On 7/5/07, vade wrote:
> Hello
>
> Id like to announce the beta release of some shaders Ive been working on.
>
> You can read all about them here:
>
> http://001.vade.info/?p=18
>
> or just download them here:
>
> http://001.vade.info/v001/downloads/v001ShadersB1.zip
>
> Id love some feedback, i expect some rough edges, so feel free to contact me
> off list for any suggestions, complaints, incompatibilities or issues.
>
> Ive only tested these shaders on OS X on a few machines, so id be curious of
> XP support, but ive followed some pretty loose guidelines to keep things as
> compatible and fast as possible.
>
> Thanks. I plan on releasing shaders every so often, and id love to know what
> people need/want shader wise. Im looking to create a pretty decently large
> library of useful, consistent and fast shaders. If you are interested in
> helping out, please chime in and speak up.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> v a d e //
>
> http://www.vade.info
> abstrakt.vade.info
>
>
>
>
>
>


July 5, 2007 | 12:02 am

re: the noise function – thats very strange. where do you find out
this information on what functions are and are not supported by GPUS?
the noise3 function is stated in the GLSL spec and cheatsheet/
quickguide which is what im referencing. Its clearly making noise on
my system (as the shader works). is it somehow running on the CPU ?

itd be easy enough to modify the shader as you state. Still..

thanks!

On Jul 4, 2007, at 7:43 PM, Wesley Smith wrote:

> Nice work vade. A few initial coments:
>
> Could you add an esc key -> fullscreen to the patches?
>
> Also, any built-in GLSL noise functions are not going to run on the
> GPU since no GPU actually supports them. The faster solution is to
> pass in a buffer of noise and a buffer of indices. In a vertex shader
> this would be a const array of noise declared in the shader (since
> most cards don’t support textures in the vertex shader right now) and
> a matrix of indices which could be passed in through one of
> jit.gl.mesh’s inlets or by one of the model’s per-vertex parameters.
> See vd.gnoise.3d.jxs for an example.
>
> wes
>
> On 7/5/07, vade wrote:
>> Hello
>>
>> Id like to announce the beta release of some shaders Ive been
>> working on.
>>
>> You can read all about them here:
>>
>> http://001.vade.info/?p=18
>>
>> or just download them here:
>>
>> http://001.vade.info/v001/downloads/v001ShadersB1.zip
>>
>> Id love some feedback, i expect some rough edges, so feel free to
>> contact me
>> off list for any suggestions, complaints, incompatibilities or
>> issues.
>>
>> Ive only tested these shaders on OS X on a few machines, so id be
>> curious of
>> XP support, but ive followed some pretty loose guidelines to keep
>> things as
>> compatible and fast as possible.
>>
>> Thanks. I plan on releasing shaders every so often, and id love to
>> know what
>> people need/want shader wise. Im looking to create a pretty
>> decently large
>> library of useful, consistent and fast shaders. If you are
>> interested in
>> helping out, please chime in and speak up.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> v a d e //
>>
>> http://www.vade.info
>> abstrakt.vade.info
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

v a d e //

http://www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info


July 5, 2007 | 12:08 am

http://lists.apple.com/archives/Mac-opengl/2006/Nov/msg00201.html
Random places on the internets. When I run the shader it works, but
is incredibly slow.

wes

On 7/5/07, vade wrote:
>
> re: the noise function – thats very strange. where do you find out this
> information on what functions are and are not supported by GPUS? the noise3
> function is stated in the GLSL spec and cheatsheet/quickguide which is what
> im referencing. Its clearly making noise on my system (as the shader works).
> is it somehow running on the CPU ?
>
> itd be easy enough to modify the shader as you state. Still..
>
> thanks!
>
>
> On Jul 4, 2007, at 7:43 PM, Wesley Smith wrote:
>
> Nice work vade. A few initial coments:
>
> Could you add an esc key -> fullscreen to the patches?
>
> Also, any built-in GLSL noise functions are not going to run on the
> GPU since no GPU actually supports them. The faster solution is to
> pass in a buffer of noise and a buffer of indices. In a vertex shader
> this would be a const array of noise declared in the shader (since
> most cards don’t support textures in the vertex shader right now) and
> a matrix of indices which could be passed in through one of
> jit.gl.mesh’s inlets or by one of the model’s per-vertex parameters.
> See vd.gnoise.3d.jxs for an example.
>
> wes
>
> On 7/5/07, vade
wrote:
> Hello
>
> Id like to announce the beta release of some shaders Ive been working on.
>
> You can read all about them here:
>
> http://001.vade.info/?p=18
>
> or just download them here:
>
> http://001.vade.info/v001/downloads/v001ShadersB1.zip
>
> Id love some feedback, i expect some rough edges, so feel free to contact me
> off list for any suggestions, complaints, incompatibilities or issues.
>
> Ive only tested these shaders on OS X on a few machines, so id be curious of
> XP support, but ive followed some pretty loose guidelines to keep things as
> compatible and fast as possible.
>
> Thanks. I plan on releasing shaders every so often, and id love to know what
> people need/want shader wise. Im looking to create a pretty decently large
> library of useful, consistent and fast shaders. If you are interested in
> helping out, please chime in and speak up.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> v a d e //
>
> http://www.vade.info
> abstrakt.vade.info
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> v a d e //
>
> http://www.vade.info
> abstrakt.vade.info
>
>
>
>
>
>


July 5, 2007 | 12:13 am

I think I hear baby jesus crying. Thanks. christ. Doesnt someone make
a freaking list? you’d imagine if it was in the freaking spec.

Full screen option noted :) Thanks again. Ill update the noise
function when im not depressed :)

On Jul 4, 2007, at 8:08 PM, Wesley Smith wrote:

> http://lists.apple.com/archives/Mac-opengl/2006/Nov/msg00201.html
> Random places on the internets. When I run the shader it works, but
> is incredibly slow.
>
> wes
>
> On 7/5/07, vade wrote:
>>
>> re: the noise function – thats very strange. where do you find out
>> this
>> information on what functions are and are not supported by GPUS?
>> the noise3
>> function is stated in the GLSL spec and cheatsheet/quickguide
>> which is what
>> im referencing. Its clearly making noise on my system (as the
>> shader works).
>> is it somehow running on the CPU ?
>>
>> itd be easy enough to modify the shader as you state. Still..
>>
>> thanks!
>>
>>
>> On Jul 4, 2007, at 7:43 PM, Wesley Smith wrote:
>>
>> Nice work vade. A few initial coments:
>>
>> Could you add an esc key -> fullscreen to the patches?
>>
>> Also, any built-in GLSL noise functions are not going to run on the
>> GPU since no GPU actually supports them. The faster solution is to
>> pass in a buffer of noise and a buffer of indices. In a vertex
>> shader
>> this would be a const array of noise declared in the shader (since
>> most cards don’t support textures in the vertex shader right now) and
>> a matrix of indices which could be passed in through one of
>> jit.gl.mesh’s inlets or by one of the model’s per-vertex parameters.
>> See vd.gnoise.3d.jxs for an example.
>>
>> wes
>>
>> On 7/5/07, vade
wrote:
>> Hello
>>
>> Id like to announce the beta release of some shaders Ive been
>> working on.
>>
>> You can read all about them here:
>>
>> http://001.vade.info/?p=18
>>
>> or just download them here:
>>
>> http://001.vade.info/v001/downloads/v001ShadersB1.zip
>>
>> Id love some feedback, i expect some rough edges, so feel free to
>> contact me
>> off list for any suggestions, complaints, incompatibilities or
>> issues.
>>
>> Ive only tested these shaders on OS X on a few machines, so id be
>> curious of
>> XP support, but ive followed some pretty loose guidelines to keep
>> things as
>> compatible and fast as possible.
>>
>> Thanks. I plan on releasing shaders every so often, and id love to
>> know what
>> people need/want shader wise. Im looking to create a pretty
>> decently large
>> library of useful, consistent and fast shaders. If you are
>> interested in
>> helping out, please chime in and speak up.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>> v a d e //
>>
>> http://www.vade.info
>> abstrakt.vade.info
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> v a d e //
>>
>> http://www.vade.info
>> abstrakt.vade.info
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

v a d e //

http://www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info


July 5, 2007 | 10:39 am

Inspiring job!!
Thank you very much Vade!


July 5, 2007 | 11:57 am

Thanks so much for posting those – just what I’ve been looking for. Will post some more detailed feedback when I’ve used them some more.

Actually, I’ve been looking for cool shaders generally – principally for video processing in Jitter. Do you (or anyone else) know any good sources? I’ve drawn a bit of a blank so far.

Hadn’t actually come across your v001 system before – looks very interesting too..


July 5, 2007 | 12:32 pm

Quote: Joseph Hyde wrote on Thu, 05 July 2007 13:57
—————————————————-
> Actually, I’ve been looking for cool shaders generally – principally for video processing in Jitter. Do you (or anyone else) know any good sources? I’ve drawn a bit of a blank so far.

That’s a good point. Shaders don’t seem to be used for other purposes than real-time lighting, depth of field blurs and relief mapping, mostly in games. I’d say shaders are -the- way to go for VJ’s that need unique content. I expected some end user (not quartz composer) shaders stacking/mixing environment by now.

Mattijs

PS. Didn’t try your shaders yet, vade, but what I’ve seen from your work this must be some cool stuff, will definitly check out later.


July 5, 2007 | 2:55 pm

This is partially the whole point of me releasing these. All of the
shader tutorials are for 3D games, and not for image processing/
effects generation in 2D. I definitely plan on putting more things
out, and ive posted some things to the wiki in the form of docs.

If people mod any of these, id love to know as well. Thanks!

On Jul 5, 2007, at 8:32 AM, Mattijs Kneppers wrote:

>
> Quote: Joseph Hyde wrote on Thu, 05 July 2007 13:57
> —————————————————-
>> Actually, I’ve been looking for cool shaders generally –
>> principally for video processing in Jitter. Do you (or anyone
>> else) know any good sources? I’ve drawn a bit of a blank so far.
>
> That’s a good point. Shaders don’t seem to be used for other
> purposes than real-time lighting, depth of field blurs and relief
> mapping, mostly in games. I’d say shaders are -the- way to go for
> VJ’s that need unique content. I expected some end user (not quartz
> composer) shaders stacking/mixing environment by now.
>
> Mattijs
>
> PS. Didn’t try your shaders yet, vade, but what I’ve seen from your
> work this must be some cool stuff, will definitly check out later.
>
> –
> SmadSteck – http://www.smadsteck.nl
> Hard- and software for interactive audiovisual sampling

v a d e //

http://www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info


July 6, 2007 | 6:19 pm

>I expected some end user (not quartz composer)
>shaders stacking/mixing environment by now.

i’ve been working on something like that, but had to scale back the shader usage because of the variety of support for shaders. we’re (lividinstruments.com) about to release a program called Cell, which is a simple VJ tool, that uses shader-based mixing. I had to drop shader effects, and just go with openGL (jit.gl.mesh and the like) becuase of the difficulty of getting them working on machines I don’t have in my room. So the moral is that creating a shader-based, general-use environment is beyond my tiny brain at the moment, especially with the popularity of those crappy intelGMA 950 cards.


July 6, 2007 | 6:54 pm

Thats an interesting question. How should one handle fallback shaders
should a particular card not support certain features you wish to use?

On Jul 6, 2007, at 2:19 PM, pnyboer wrote:

>
>> I expected some end user (not quartz composer)
>> shaders stacking/mixing environment by now.
>
> i’ve been working on something like that, but had to scale back the
> shader usage because of the variety of support for shaders. we’re
> (lividinstruments.com) about to release a program called Cell,
> which is a simple VJ tool, that uses shader-based mixing. I had to
> drop shader effects, and just go with openGL (jit.gl.mesh and the
> like) becuase of the difficulty of getting them working on machines
> I don’t have in my room. So the moral is that creating a shader-
> based, general-use environment is beyond my tiny brain at the
> moment, especially with the popularity of those crappy intelGMA 950
> cards.
>
> –
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> The Lifespan
> 2 oz brandy
> 1/2 oz orgeat
> 1/2 oz maraschino
> 3/4 oz mix of (meyer) lemon and (yellow) grapefruit juice
> Shake with ice and serve in a Pernod-rinsed cocktail glass

v a d e //

http://www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info


July 6, 2007 | 9:05 pm

That’s part of what’s really hard: you have to have a fairly intimate knowledge of what your shader does and be able to predict what cards will support this. You would need to make some sort of device query external with GLEW maybe, which would tell you what features the card supported, then instantiate the appropriate shaders or effects.
Even then, it’s not a guarantee. For example, I found that my program Cell runs nicely on a core solo mini w/ a gma950 running OSX (this, of course is after I shed the majority of shader effects), but the same machine running XP runs Cell poorly. A specific example from the top of my head is when I switch between using rectangular and non-rect. textures for a particular effect – the max status window reports the card doesn’t support rectangular textures on XP, but I don’t get this on OSX. Evidently a driver issue. I’ve also been unable to get the program running under Vista – I get really severe crashes (making troubleshooting laborious) on my main PC, but it runs fine under XP on the same hardware.
I’ve also experienced that the kaledescope shader runs fine on OSX 10.4, but not under 10.39 on some machines, without a modification…a modification that doesn’t work on 10.4!. The "gestalt" object was my friend in that instance.

So there’s my long winded answer that maybe sheds some light on what is a farily involved problem.


July 6, 2007 | 11:21 pm

Well. Apple has some pretty specific GL querying software/examples on
their dev site to get supported devices, hardware and versions and
additions. Might be nice to have a:

jit.gl.slab @shader my.slab.jxs @fallback my.simpleslab.jxs

im sure something could be rigged up. But yes, it is indeed a
difficult problem.

On Jul 6, 2007, at 5:05 PM, pnyboer wrote:

>
> That’s part of what’s really hard: you have to have a fairly
> intimate knowledge of what your shader does and be able to predict
> what cards will support this. You would need to make some sort of
> device query external with GLEW maybe, which would tell you what
> features the card supported, then instantiate the appropriate
> shaders or effects.
> Even then, it’s not a guarantee. For example, I found that my
> program Cell runs nicely on a core solo mini w/ a gma950 running
> OSX (this, of course is after I shed the majority of shader
> effects), but the same machine running XP runs Cell poorly. A
> specific example from the top of my head is when I switch between
> using rectangular and non-rect. textures for a particular effect –
> the max status window reports the card doesn’t support rectangular
> textures on XP, but I don’t get this on OSX. Evidently a driver
> issue. I’ve also been unable to get the program running under
> Vista – I get really severe crashes (making troubleshooting
> laborious) on my main PC, but it runs fine under XP on the same
> hardware.
> I’ve also experienced that the kaledescope shader runs fine on OSX
> 10.4, but not under 10.39 on some machines, without a
> modification…a modification that doesn’t work on 10.4!. The
> "gestalt" object was my friend in that instance.
>
> So there’s my long winded answer that maybe sheds some light on
> what is a farily involved problem.
> –
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> The Lifespan
> 2 oz brandy
> 1/2 oz orgeat
> 1/2 oz maraschino
> 3/4 oz mix of (meyer) lemon and (yellow) grapefruit juice
> Shake with ice and serve in a Pernod-rinsed cocktail glass

v a d e //

http://www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info


July 7, 2007 | 5:03 am

If you have a benchmark patch or something ready to go, I’ll run it on my XP machine. Core2-Duo 2.0ghz, Radeon x1400. I may be able to run it on XP a MacBook Pro 2.3ghz, but my 30 days may be up.

I’m still on 4.5.x/1.5.x. on both machines.

Adam


July 7, 2007 | 9:28 am

Thanks for sharing your experiences, this is valueable information..

Mattijs

Quote: pnyboer wrote on Fri, 06 July 2007 23:05
—————————————————-
> That’s part of what’s really hard: you have to have a fairly intimate knowledge of what your shader does and be able to predict what cards will support this. You would need to make some sort of device query external with GLEW maybe, which would tell you what features the card supported, then instantiate the appropriate shaders or effects.
> Even then, it’s not a guarantee. For example, I found that my program Cell runs nicely on a core solo mini w/ a gma950 running OSX (this, of course is after I shed the majority of shader effects), but the same machine running XP runs Cell poorly. A specific example from the top of my head is when I switch between using rectangular and non-rect. textures for a particular effect – the max status window reports the card doesn’t support rectangular textures on XP, but I don’t get this on OSX. Evidently a driver issue. I’ve also been unable to get the program running under Vista – I get really severe crashes (making troubleshooting laborious) on my main PC, but it runs fine under XP on the same hardware.
> I’ve also experienced that the kaledescope shader runs fine on OSX 10.4, but not under 10.39 on some machines, without a modification…a modification that doesn’t work on 10.4!. The "gestalt" object was my friend in that instance.
>
> So there’s my long winded answer that maybe sheds some light on what is a farily involved problem.
—————————————————-


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