Forums > MaxMSP

video without jitter?

December 9, 2007 | 12:56 am

Hello, all.
I don’t currently do any work with video, however I though it would be cool to have a way for audio in Max/MSP to react to certain things happening in a source of video. Is Jitter the only way to do this? I don’t actually want to MANIPULATE or CREATE the video itself, just have previously created video influence sounds.
Any options? Jitter is great, but I’m poor and it’s hard to justify the cost for how little functionality I actually need. :)
Thanks.


December 9, 2007 | 5:04 am

Depends what you want to do. You can use the Quicktime object (non-Jitter) to play a movie, and if you want to have the colors etc. affect the sound you could use the "suckah" (looks like a needle) which will tell you pixel RGB values anywhere on the screen, so just put it over the video and click, or you can send it pixel coordinates. Take each RGB and use it, or average them for luminosity perhaps. I’m sure there’s more non-Jitter stuff you could figure out, but those come to mind first.

I think once you had Jitter you’d want to delve into its cool stuff ;) though I understand being poor, believe me. Send money!

–CJ


December 9, 2007 | 6:17 am

Hey, yeah!
Didn’t know about the movie and imovie objects.
That would do what I want for pre-recorded video.
Any way to get a live feed in? Like, maybe from my MBP’s isight?
I’m coming to the end of my 9-month student license, and will be student teaching next semester (therefore, no income), so all I will be able to afford with Xmas money is Max/MSP. Perhaps once I’m employed after school, I’ll go for Jitter. Luckily, I’m planning on teaching, so I’ll always be able to take advantage of edu discounts. :)


December 21, 2007 | 6:09 pm

Another video tool to look into is GEM. While I messed around with GEM a few times working with PureData I am only recently getting into any serious learning about video in either PureData or Max/MSP so I can’t tell you much about the differences between GEM and Jitter (they handle data differently if I understand correctly) because I’m waiting for the weekend to install the 30day Jitter demo.

I am pretty sure you will be able to get the live video data you want from GEM. While it is free, the GEM documentation seems week compared to what is available in the Jitter tutorials. You can get a port of GEM to Max here:

http://gem4mac.sourceforge.net/


December 21, 2007 | 10:04 pm

I downloaded and installed GEM but didn’t get very far. I am running
Max/MSP 4.6.3 with OSX 10.4.10 on a MacBook Pro. It crashes as soon as I
start rendering. I have the crash report.

On 12/21/07 1:09 PM, "Roth Michaels" wrote:

>
> Another video tool to look into is GEM. While I messed around with GEM a few
> times working with PureData I am only recently getting into any serious
> learning about video in either PureData or Max/MSP so I can’t tell you much
> about the differences between GEM and Jitter (they handle data differently if
> I understand correctly) because I’m waiting for the weekend to install the
> 30day Jitter demo.
>
> I am pretty sure you will be able to get the live video data you want from
> GEM. While it is free, the GEM documentation seems week compared to what is
> available in the Jitter tutorials. You can get a port of GEM to Max here:
>
> http://gem4mac.sourceforge.net/

Cheers
Gary Lee Nelson
Oberlin College
http://www.timara.oberlin.edu/GaryLeeNelson


December 22, 2007 | 3:17 am

Quote: Gary Lee Nelson wrote on Fri, 21 December 2007 15:04
—————————————————-
> I downloaded and installed GEM but didn’t get very far. I am running
> Max/MSP 4.6.3 with OSX 10.4.10 on a MacBook Pro. It crashes as soon as I
> start rendering. I have the crash report.

First thing is to make sure that Overdrive is turned off in Max, not sure if this will cause crashes, but this is important for GEM.

So far from what I’ve seen GEM seems a little less stable on Max/MSP versus running it on PureData, but still worth trying to get to work I think. I’m running GEM on 10.4.11 with Max/MSP 4.6.3 and at first I was having crashes when sending [gem.gemwin] a "destroy" message. It turns out this bug only happnes if you try to destroy the gemwindow before you have ever turned rendering on or off.

When you say it crashes as soon as you start rendering, do you mean when you send [gem.gemwin] a "create" message or a "1" message? Not that I know much about it, but I would be curious to see your crash log to see if it is all similar to mine.

So far I haven’t seen much searching this lists or the PureData lists about GEM4Max, but I may end up posting on the pd-gem-dev list to see if any GEM4Max users/devs hang there to discuss bugs with.



p-s
December 22, 2007 | 8:45 am

hi,

give a look at Eyesweb

http://www.infomus.dist.unige.it/eywindex.html

Paolo


December 22, 2007 | 1:54 pm

Thanks, Roth,

Turning off overdrive did indeed fix most of the crashes. Sending the
destroy before rendering still crashes but a "create, 1" messages is an easy
workaround.

I wonder if the GEM developers read this list. I probably should be sending
them the bug reports.

I am just getting started on the documentation but a very basic question
occurred to me. There seems to be a single shared render window that all of
the other objects share. Will the documentation reveal a method for
recording the images that are rendered?

Cheers
Gary Lee Nelson
Oberlin College
http://www.timara.oberlin.edu/GaryLeeNelson

On 12/21/07 10:18 PM, "Roth Michaels" wrote:

>
> Quote: Gary Lee Nelson wrote on Fri, 21 December 2007 15:04
> —————————————————-
>> I downloaded and installed GEM but didn’t get very far. I am running
>> Max/MSP 4.6.3 with OSX 10.4.10 on a MacBook Pro. It crashes as soon as I
>> start rendering. I have the crash report.
>
> First thing is to make sure that Overdrive is turned off in Max, not sure if
> this will cause crashes, but this is important for GEM.
>
> So far from what I’ve seen GEM seems a little less stable on Max/MSP versus
> running it on PureData, but still worth trying to get to work I think. I’m
> running GEM on 10.4.11 with Max/MSP 4.6.3 and at first I was having crashes
> when sending [gem.gemwin] a "destroy" message. It turns out this bug only
> happnes if you try to destroy the gemwindow before you have ever turned
> rendering on or off.
>
> When you say it crashes as soon as you start rendering, do you mean when you
> send [gem.gemwin] a "create" message or a "1" message? Not that I know much
> about it, but I would be curious to see your crash log to see if it is all
> similar to mine.
>
> So far I haven’t seen much searching this lists or the PureData lists about
> GEM4Max, but I may end up posting on the pd-gem-dev list to see if any GEM4Max
> users/devs hang there to discuss bugs with.


December 22, 2007 | 2:05 pm

This seems to be PC only.

On 12/22/07 3:45 AM, "Paolo Squarzon"

wrote:

>
> hi,
>
> give a look at Eyesweb
>
> http://www.infomus.dist.unige.it/eywindex.html
>
> Paolo

Cheers
Gary Lee Nelson
Oberlin College
http://www.timara.oberlin.edu/GaryLeeNelson


December 24, 2007 | 6:53 am

Quote: Gary Lee Nelson wrote on Sat, 22 December 2007 06:54
—————————————————-

> I am just getting started on the documentation but a very basic question
> occurred to me. There seems to be a single shared render window that all of
> the other objects share. Will the documentation reveal a method for
> recording the images that are rendered?

Quickly looking through the example files, I didn’t see anything that jumped out at me regarding this or your OP. I am pretty sure you can both stream video to disk from the gemwin and that you can use the video data (either live or from a file) to control audio in Max/MSP. Now, keeping in mind that other than a few times I decided to browse the examples when I used to work PureData, I am pretty sure you can both write your GEMwin to a file and use the incoming video to manipulate the sound (at least this is what I assume from things I’ve read or heard from other GEM users). I’m going to be diving into learning GEM and Jitter (started my demo period the other day) over the next few days so I’ll let you know what I discover. Also, I’m getting together with a bandmate you uses GEM so I’ll ask him about these questions.


December 24, 2007 | 1:51 pm

I did find an object with record in its name but haven’t had a chance to ive
the documentation a fair going over.

On 12/24/07 1:53 AM, "Roth Michaels" wrote:

>
> Quote: Gary Lee Nelson wrote on Sat, 22 December 2007 06:54
> —————————————————-
>
>> I am just getting started on the documentation but a very basic question
>> occurred to me. There seems to be a single shared render window that all of
>> the other objects share. Will the documentation reveal a method for
>> recording the images that are rendered?
>
> Quickly looking through the example files, I didn’t see anything that jumped
> out at me regarding this or your OP. I am pretty sure you can both stream
> video to disk from the gemwin and that you can use the video data (either live
> or from a file) to control audio in Max/MSP. Now, keeping in mind that other
> than a few times I decided to browse the examples when I used to work
> PureData, I am pretty sure you can both write your GEMwin to a file and use
> the incoming video to manipulate the sound (at least this is what I assume
> from things I’ve read or heard from other GEM users). I’m going to be diving
> into learning GEM and Jitter (started my demo period the other day) over the
> next few days so I’ll let you know what I discover. Also, I’m getting
> together with a bandmate you uses GEM so I’ll ask him about these questions.

Cheers
Gary Lee Nelson
Oberlin College
http://www.timara.oberlin.edu/GaryLeeNelson


December 24, 2007 | 3:19 pm

I’m getting messages like this when I try to load even just the very first basic GEM example (redsquare):

• error: gem.gemwin: unable to load object bundle executable
2007-12-24 09:17:52.901 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemwin.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemwin: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemwin.mxo/Content
s/MacOS/gem.gemwin, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemwin.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemwin
Reason: image not found
• error: gem.gemhead: unable to load object bundle executable
2007-12-24 09:17:52.921 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemhead.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemhead: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemhead.mxo/Cont
ents/MacOS/gem.gemhead, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemhead.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemhead
Reason: image not found
• error: gem.color: unable to load object bundle executable
2007-12-24 09:17:52.947 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.color.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.color: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.color.mxo/Contents/M
acOS/gem.color, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.color.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.color
Reason: image not found
• error: gem.square: unable to load object bundle executable
2007-12-24 09:17:52.960 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.square.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.square: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.square.mxo/Content
s/MacOS/gem.square, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.square.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.square
Reason: image not found
• error: gem.rotate: unable to load object bundle executable
2007-12-24 09:17:52.979 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.rotate.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.rotate: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.rotate.mxo/Content
s/MacOS/gem.rotate, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.rotate.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.rotate
Reason: image not found

Perhaps a Leopard problem? I’m on 10.5.1.


December 24, 2007 | 6:07 pm

Just want to make sure everything is covered, but do other objects you have in your "/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/"? I only ask because I’ve never used a folder with spaces in the name as part of a Max search path before. I’m not saying it won’t work, just never tried it either way myself. Seeing that you have trouble loading things from your Frameworks folder, I"m guessing it probably isn’t a search path issue.

I noticed that your GEM.framework folder is located inside /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks. I am not sure if GEM works well or not in a local library folder (I install all things like that in my /Library), but in theory it shouldn’t be a problem. Which User are you trying to use Max/MSP/GEM under, eric or hirai? This I bet is your problem since Max is trying to find the GEM externals in a part of the search path in eric’s home folder while the frameworks it needs are in hirai’s home folder, only one of which you can have access to at a time.

As far as running it on 10.5.1, I can’t say for sure, but I am home visiting my family and helping them upgrade their computers to Leopard so I’ll try it out on one of their computers and let you know if I can get GEM to work.

Good luck,

Roth

Quote: mopppish wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 08:19
—————————————————-
> I’m getting messages like this when I try to load even just the very first basic GEM example (redsquare):
>
> • error: gem.gemwin: unable to load object bundle executable
> 2007-12-24 09:17:52.901 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemwin.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemwin: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemwin.mxo/Content
> s/MacOS/gem.gemwin, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
> Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemwin.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemwin
> Reason: image not found
> • error: gem.gemhead: unable to load object bundle executable
> 2007-12-24 09:17:52.921 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemhead.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemhead: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemhead.mxo/Cont
> ents/MacOS/gem.gemhead, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
> Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.gemhead.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.gemhead
> Reason: image not found
> • error: gem.color: unable to load object bundle executable
> 2007-12-24 09:17:52.947 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.color.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.color: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.color.mxo/Contents/M
> acOS/gem.color, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
> Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.color.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.color
> Reason: image not found
> • error: gem.square: unable to load object bundle executable
> 2007-12-24 09:17:52.960 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.square.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.square: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.square.mxo/Content
> s/MacOS/gem.square, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
> Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.square.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.square
> Reason: image not found
> • error: gem.rotate: unable to load object bundle executable
> 2007-12-24 09:17:52.979 MaxMSP[1913:20b] Error loading /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.rotate.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.rotate: dlopen(/Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.rotate.mxo/Content
> s/MacOS/gem.rotate, 262): Library not loaded: /Users/hirai/Library/Frameworks/GEM.framework/Versions/A/GEM
> Referenced from: /Users/eric/Documents/Max Extra Stuff/gem4max/gem-externals-mxo/gem.rotate.mxo/Contents/MacOS/gem.rotate
> Reason: image not found
>
> Perhaps a Leopard problem? I’m on 10.5.1.
>
—————————————————-


December 24, 2007 | 10:22 pm

No idea who "hirai" is…
I load other objects from the same folder, and they work fine.
Tried it from the desktop, too. Didn’t work.
Nevertheless, I’ll try taking the folder out of my directory and see what happens.
Thanks!


December 24, 2007 | 10:30 pm

Quote: mopppish wrote on Mon, 24 December 2007 15:22
—————————————————-
> No idea who "hirai" is…

Are you using multiple users on this computer? hirai looks like it is the short name of one of these other users.

Roth


December 24, 2007 | 10:52 pm

No, sir.
No hirai anywhere. No users but me. Just checked.
I just tried plopping the GEM stuff in the applications folder and starting it from there (as that’s outside my home folder). Bad idea. Max refused to start back up with "applications" ad a search path and didn’t work gain until I trashed the maxsearchpaths preference file.
Still no luck with running GEM.


June 1, 2012 | 2:46 am

I am getting the same users/hirai oriented error and I also don’t have a clue who that is. I’m guessing it’s hard-coded into the externals reference somewhere. Ever figure it out? Still trying…


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