Big set - CPU strategy ?


    May 01 2008 | 7:16 am
    Hi list.
    And quite new to MAx (6 months now) and need some assistance on a particular point.
    I'm currently working on the musical part of a dance performance.
    I have 10 different sets (patches). They all deal with real-time audio or video processing, using contact mics and/or video tracking.
    Now the problem is: they all work fine independently, but if i want the audio to be continuous between the scenes (making transitions), i need to load and run at least 2 patches at the same time (1 + 2 / 2 + 3 / 3 + 4 etc...)
    So I tried different approaches for this, the first is one mega-patch containing all ten subpatches, and muting (with mute~) all unused patches successively, but even whith muting, i have severe audio dropouts and clicks.
    The other approach was having a "control center" patch loading externally all the patches one after the other with always 2 sets open at the same time. (Opening nr 3 closes nr 1, opening nr 4 closes nr 2, etc...) but i also have (sometimes long) audio interruptions during loading times.
    So... i'm wondering if you can share some knowledge to help me solve this issue.
    (And oh yes... i also have to run Ableton Live in parallel to route some audio back and forth. But the problem arise even without Live)
    Thanks in advance !
    Philippe
    max 4.6.3 with MBP 2,33 dualcore 2 Gb Ram

    • May 01 2008 | 9:03 am
      Hi,
      with Max5 you can change dinamically the subpatch included in a poly~.
      So you can use two main poly~ where you change the subpatch.
      Don't know if this applies to video too.
      All the best
      --
      Alessandro Fogar
      2008/5/1 Philippe Jelli :
      >
      > Hi list.
      >
      > And quite new to MAx (6 months now) and need some assistance on a particular point.
      >
      > I'm currently working on the musical part of a dance performance.
      >
      > I have 10 different sets (patches). They all deal with real-time audio or video processing, using contact mics and/or video tracking.
      >
      > Now the problem is: they all work fine independently, but if i want the audio to be continuous between the scenes (making transitions), i need to load and run at least 2 patches at the same time (1 + 2 / 2 + 3 / 3 + 4 etc...)
      >
      > So I tried different approaches for this, the first is one mega-patch containing all ten subpatches, and muting (with mute~) all unused patches successively, but even whith muting, i have severe audio dropouts and clicks.
      >
      > The other approach was having a "control center" patch loading externally all the patches one after the other with always 2 sets open at the same time. (Opening nr 3 closes nr 1, opening nr 4 closes nr 2, etc...) but i also have (sometimes long) audio interruptions during loading times.
      >
      > So... i'm wondering if you can share some knowledge to help me solve this issue.
      >
      > (And oh yes... i also have to run Ableton Live in parallel to route some audio back and forth. But the problem arise even without Live)
      >
      > Thanks in advance !
      >
      > Philippe
      >
      > max 4.6.3 with MBP 2,33 dualcore 2 Gb Ram
      >
      >
    • May 01 2008 | 9:22 am
      Thanks for your reply.
      unfortunately, for this one i have to stay in 4.6.3, because it uses some externals not yet available for 5 (ICST Ambisonics)
      And by the way, i don't use much poly's (excepted maybe in one or two patches), but a lot of buffers.
      Maybe that's what causing the problem at loading time.
      Ph
    • May 01 2008 | 9:33 am
      On 01-mai-08, at 09:16, Philippe Jelli wrote:
      > So I tried different approaches for this, the first is one mega-patch
      > containing all ten subpatches, and muting (with mute~) all unused
      > patches successively, but even whith muting, i have severe audio
      > dropouts and clicks.
      Another approach is to use [poly~ subpatch_1 1], [poly~ subpatch_2 1],
      [poly~ subpatch_3 1], etc. i.e. a poly with only one voice and mute
      that voice when it is not used. It is suppose to work better than
      [mute~] and worked well for me so far.
      Of course, you have to make sure 2 subpatches can run concurrently.
      p
    • May 01 2008 | 9:40 am
      Hi.
      Did you try to load all patches together and mute them on load (I've
      always prefered use [poly~] rather than [mute~] for that kind of things).
      This way, you just need to mute/unmute them for your transitions,
      without loading patches on the fly (which is probably the cause of your
      audio dropouts).
      @Alessandro
      I guess that dynamically changing your poly~ will also create audio
      dropouts (as for scripting, ...).
      Ciao.
    • May 01 2008 | 10:13 am
      mmmh. I never thought of using poly~ for this purpose, i'll give it a try.
      But i'm wondering, some patches use realtime video analysis, or submixes dac~'s to send audio to Live (using soundflower), will this work inside of a poly ?
      The first test i did gives me a lot of error messages like "signal outlet (*~) or (gain~) connected to nonsignal inlet (dac~)" when i enclose my subpatch inside a poly~
      i suppose i'll have to drastically change the global architecture of my patches, if i want to use poly~, and put all these sends out of the poly~ - i'm not to familiar with these
      Thanks a lot for your help.
    • May 01 2008 | 12:23 pm
      Hi,
      2008/5/1 gusano :
      > @Alessandro
      > I guess that dynamically changing your poly~ will also create audio dropouts
      > (as for scripting, ...).
      Not in Max5.
      All the best
      --
      Alessandro Fogar
    • May 01 2008 | 4:14 pm
      Ok, ignore my previous post, all my routings seems to work fine, even inside the poly's.
      I still have some clicks and glitches, but nothing to compare with the previous situation. I think i need to clean my patches and remove all unnecessary objects like number boxes and waveforms...
      Thanks again
      Ph
    • May 03 2008 | 10:08 am
      Alessandro Fogar schrieb:
      > Hi,
      >
      > with Max5 you can change dinamically the subpatch included in a poly~.
      >
      > So you can use two main poly~ where you change the subpatch.
      How? It isn't mentioned in the docs... (And how would you deal with
      different numbers of ins/outs???)
      This was pssoble for vst~ in Max 4 already, but as pluggos don't work in
      Max 5, it isn't an option in Max 5...
      Stefan
      --
      Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
      --_____-----------|--------------
      --(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
      -- _|_)----|-----()--------------
      ----------()--------www.ccmix.com
    • May 03 2008 | 10:23 am
      I found here this information
      for in-out I suppose we have to build a 'prototype' poly~ with the maximum in-out number needed...
      matteo
    • May 03 2008 | 10:31 am
      Well,
      I didn't try but here they tell about it:
      I agree with you that you cannon find it in the docs.
      Now we need a confirm from Cycling elves, is it true ?
      About the different nubers of in/out: I think you have to deal with by
      yourself (dummy inouts and outputs for example).
      All the best
      --
      Alessandro Fogar
      2008/5/3 Stefan Tiedje :
      > Alessandro Fogar schrieb:
      >>
      >> Hi,
      >>
      >> with Max5 you can change dinamically the subpatch included in a poly~.
      >>
      >> So you can use two main poly~ where you change the subpatch.
      >
      > How? It isn't mentioned in the docs... (And how would you deal with
      > different numbers of ins/outs???)
      > This was pssoble for vst~ in Max 4 already, but as pluggos don't work in
      > Max 5, it isn't an option in Max 5...
      >
      > Stefan
      >
      > --
      > Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
      > --_____-----------|--------------
      > --(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
      > -- _|_)----|-----()--------------
      > ----------()--------www.ccmix.com
      >
      >
      >
    • May 05 2008 | 10:24 am
      matpe wrote:
      > I found here this information
      >
      > http://www.cycling74.com/docs/max5/vignettes/core/compat_plugin.html
      >
      Wow, that's *great* !
      Thanx C74 !!!