Distanced Camera


    Nov 14 2006 | 4:10 pm
    hallo,
    i need a cheap video camera compatible with jitter on mac os x that can be placed in a room separate from the computer. the cable length would be around 20m, so USB and firewire are not possible without expensive repeaters etc. as i understand, there are two options: wireless, so i'd have the receiver in the other room (the actually the "direct" distance between camera + receiver would be really small, like a few meters, but there is a massive wall between them); i saw some models but none of them had a receiver that would output the video signal as USB or firewire. the other option i guess is an IP network camera over ethernet, some models are really cheap like 100 EUR. but then how do i receive the images in jitter? as far as i understand, the pictures are streamed via HTTP (?) as MPEG-4 or similar streams. is there any model that's mac compatible and whose images i can get into jitter? i don't need fast frame rates, i guess a few frames per second are sufficient.
    thanks for hints. ciao, -sciss-

    • Nov 14 2006 | 4:23 pm
      >hallo,
      >
      >i need a cheap video camera compatible with jitter on mac os x that
      >can be placed in a room separate from the computer. the cable length
      >would be around 20m, so USB and firewire are not possible without
      >expensive repeaters etc.
      I did use unibrains with 3 FW cables of 10 meters (9.60 to be more
      precise) and powered FW hubs, serving as repeaters (if not powered
      they are just hubs)
      had no problems...
      best
      kasper
      --
      Kasper T. Toeplitz
      noise, composition, bass, computer
    • Nov 14 2006 | 4:30 pm
      You could alternatively use an analog camera, and BNC cable/SVideo
      whatever, to run for very long distances with out the need for a
      distribution amplifier, and use a hardware video capture (A/D
      converter), that is QT compatible. Something like the DFG-1394 from
      the imaging source (I really need to get one of those..).
      v a d e //
      www.vade.info
      abstrakt.vade.info
      On Nov 14, 2006, at 11:23 AM, Kasper T Toeplitz wrote:
      >> hallo,
      >>
      >> i need a cheap video camera compatible with jitter on mac os x
      >> that can be placed in a room separate from the computer. the cable
      >> length would be around 20m, so USB and firewire are not possible
      >> without expensive repeaters etc.
      >
      >
      > I did use unibrains with 3 FW cables of 10 meters (9.60 to be more
      > precise) and powered FW hubs, serving as repeaters (if not powered
      > they are just hubs)
      >
      > had no problems...
      >
      > best
      >
      > kasper
      > --
      > Kasper T. Toeplitz
      > noise, composition, bass, computer
      > http://www.sleazeArt.com
      >
      >
    • Nov 14 2006 | 4:35 pm
      Quote: vade wrote on Tue, 14 November 2006 17:30
      ----------------------------------------------------
      > You could alternatively use an analog camera, and BNC cable/SVideo
      > whatever, to run for very long distances with out the need for a
      > distribution amplifier, and use a hardware video capture (A/D
      > converter), that is QT compatible. Something like the DFG-1394 from
      > the imaging source (I really need to get one of those..).
      Yeah, we use a long (20m) bnc + audio cable that goes into an ADVC-100 (http://dv411.com/advc100.html)
      Mattijs
    • Nov 14 2006 | 4:39 pm
      You could run a composite cable then convert using this http://
      www.theimagingsource.com/en/products/converters/dfg13941e/
      overview/ I've not used it myself but I was asking how to convert
      composite to firewire and this is what was recomended. I've ran video
      down a composite cable over a far longer distance than 20m so it
      should work fine.
      JK
      On 14 Nov 2006, at 16:10, Sciss wrote:
      >
      > hallo,
      >
      > i need a cheap video camera compatible with jitter on mac os x that
      > can be placed in a room separate from the computer. the cable
      > length would be around 20m, so USB and firewire are not possible
      > without expensive repeaters etc. as i understand, there are two
      > options: wireless, so i'd have the receiver in the other room (the
      > actually the "direct" distance between camera + receiver would be
      > really small, like a few meters, but there is a massive wall
      > between them); i saw some models but none of them had a receiver
      > that would output the video signal as USB or firewire. the other
      > option i guess is an IP network camera over ethernet, some models
      > are really cheap like 100 EUR. but then how do i receive the images
      > in jitter? as far as i understand, the pictures are streamed via
      > HTTP (?) as MPEG-4 or similar streams. is there any model that's
      > mac compatible and whose images i can get into jitter? i don't need
      > fast frame rates, i guess a few frames per second are sufficient.
      >
      > thanks for hints. ciao, -sciss-
      >
      > --
      > Virus scanned by Lumison.
      Jack Keenan
      360tv Coordinator
      Peacock Visual Arts
      21 Castle Street
      Aberdeen
      AB11 5BQ
      Tel: 01224 639539
      Fax: 01224 627094
      www.360tv.org.uk
      www.superchannel.org
      www.peacockvisualarts.com
    • Nov 14 2006 | 6:30 pm
      On 14 nov. 06, at 17:35, Mattijs Kneppers wrote:
      > Yeah, we use a long (20m) bnc + audio cable that goes into an
      Just out of curiosity, does anyone have a chance to compare
      performances between ADVC-100 and DFG-1394?
      ej
    • Nov 14 2006 | 6:50 pm
      Well, the DFG is an uncompressed FW input, and uses more bandwidth,
      and the ADC100/110 is a DV converter, so you are getting compression,
      compression artifacts and color loss due to the very poor DV
      colorspace. DV also introduces a frame lag, on OS X 10.4, I believe
      it is down to 4 frames, on 10.3, 7 frames. DFG has .. I believe, 0 to
      1 frames of lag.
      DFG wins hands down
      FINISH HIM!!!
      v a d e //
      www.vade.info
      abstrakt.vade.info
      On Nov 14, 2006, at 1:30 PM, Emmanuel Jourdan wrote:
      > On 14 nov. 06, at 17:35, Mattijs Kneppers wrote:
      >
      >> Yeah, we use a long (20m) bnc + audio cable that goes into an
      >> ADVC-100 (http://dv411.com/advc100.html)
      >
      > Just out of curiosity, does anyone have a chance to compare
      > performances between ADVC-100 and DFG-1394?
      >
      > ej
      >
      >
    • Nov 14 2006 | 6:58 pm
      On 14 nov. 06, at 19:50, vade wrote:
      > Well, the DFG is an uncompressed FW input, and uses more bandwidth,
      > and the ADC100/110 is a DV converter, so you are getting
      > compression, compression artifacts and color loss due to the very
      > poor DV colorspace. DV also introduces a frame lag, on OS X 10.4, I
      > believe it is down to 4 frames, on 10.3, 7 frames. DFG has .. I
      > believe, 0 to 1 frames of lag.
      >
      > DFG wins hands down
      Vade,
      Thanks for confirming.
      ej
    • Nov 17 2006 | 2:39 pm
      I use my miniDv camera as a analog-digital converter. Don't know if all digital cameras have this feature (I must assume they do because most cams allow for composit video input) but I use it to connect an analog camera to my computer. I use it among other things for motion tracking. It solves both the cable length problem and the speed/latency problem. Works great.
    • Nov 17 2006 | 2:47 pm
      hallo,
      thanks for all your answers. i will go for the solution cheap-dv-cam with composite out --> analog cable --> cheap dv capture.
      the only bad thing is some of the personnel will probably have to turn on recording on the camera every day. the cool thing about direct fw is the total control from software (e.g. apple isight would start to open the lens and so on when sending the appropriate commands from jitter. it's a pity they don't sell an updated ecologically compliant version of this camera b.t.w.)
      sciss
    • Nov 17 2006 | 4:58 pm
      There is an alternative to use the FireWire cable of Datavideo. They have a 20 meter version and it works fine if you have a FirewireCard which outputs enough power. You must try this.
      I used three of those cables, 60 meters, with 2 of their repeaters (no external power) and it worked with only a little quality-loss.
      They cost about $80,-
      I used this Firewire-card to power the 60meter setup: ADS TECH Acquisitiekaart PCI 3 poorten FireWire PYRO Basic DV - compatible PC & Mac. ($30-)
      An advice of Datavideo.
    • Nov 26 2006 | 4:01 pm
      hi all,
      to complete the thread, i have now bought a rather cheap CMOS surveillance camera (140 EUR) which has analog video output, another 10 EUR for a twenty meter BNC cable and a canopus ADVC-55 analog-to-firewire DV converter (200 EUR), working pretty well with jitter.
      the cmos camera solves the problem of having a person needing to switch it on/off as would have occurred with a miniDV camcorder. the only bad thing now is automatic gain control, but that should be fixable in software.
      thanks again for various suggestions. best, -sciss-
    • Dec 01 2006 | 3:54 pm
      http://lindy.com/ also sell firewire cables with integrated repeater... 4.5mt each can be chained up to 40 mt.
      does nobody has experience video radio trasmitters?