MEGA app size?


    Aug 16 2006 | 8:12 pm
    Using Max/MSP 4.6 on a MacIntel, I was shocked to find that after turning my patch into a standalone application, its size was 30+ MB.
    To debug, I made a patch with nothing in it, built it into a standalone, and that is 15.1 MB.
    Something don't seem right.
    Dan -- Dan Nigrin Defective Records 202 Hack / PC-1600 User / VSTi Host / OMS Convert / Jack OS X http://www.defectiverecords.com http://www.jackosx.com

    • Aug 16 2006 | 8:30 pm
      Why? The runtime itself for 4.6 is 18 megs. This isnt 'compiled' software, but a repackaged runtime that loads only your patch? Im suprised the standalone was 15 megs ;)
      v a d e //
      www.vade.info abstrakt.vade.info
      On Aug 16, 2006, at 4:12 PM, Dan Nigrin wrote:
      > Using Max/MSP 4.6 on a MacIntel, I was shocked to find that after > turning my patch into a standalone application, its size was 30+ MB. > > To debug, I made a patch with nothing in it, built it into a > standalone, and that is 15.1 MB. > > Something don't seem right. > > Dan > -- > Dan Nigrin > Defective Records > 202 Hack / PC-1600 User / VSTi Host / OMS Convert / Jack OS X > http://www.defectiverecords.com > http://www.jackosx.com >
    • Aug 16 2006 | 8:38 pm
      Well, considering that the 4.5.x Runtime was only 2.2 MB, this is a real drag if this is the way it's going to have to be... Cycling?
      Dan
      At 4:30 PM -0400 8/16/06, vade wrote: >Why? The runtime itself for 4.6 is 18 megs. This isnt 'compiled' >software, but a repackaged runtime that loads only your patch? Im >suprised the standalone was 15 megs ;)
      -- Dan Nigrin Defective Records 202 Hack / PC-1600 User / VSTi Host / OMS Convert / Jack OS X http://www.defectiverecords.com http://www.jackosx.com
    • Aug 16 2006 | 8:47 pm
      Not knowing very much about how Universal Binary really work, I would expect MaxPlay 4.6 to be at least twice as large as Max 4.5 as it needs to contain binaries for both PPC and Intel.
      Trond
      > Well, considering that the 4.5.x Runtime was only 2.2 MB, this is a > real drag if this is the way it's going to have to be... Cycling? >> Why? The runtime itself for 4.6 is 18 megs. This isnt 'compiled' >> software, but a repackaged runtime that loads only your patch? Im >> suprised the standalone was 15 megs ;) >
    • Aug 16 2006 | 8:53 pm
      Right Trond, but that's why I was suprised to see the ~5 fold increase, not ~2 fold...
      Dan
      At 10:47 PM +0200 8/16/06, Trond Lossius wrote: >Not knowing very much about how Universal Binary really work, I >would expect MaxPlay 4.6 to be at least twice as large as Max 4.5 as >it needs to contain binaries for both PPC and Intel. > >Trond > >>Well, considering that the 4.5.x Runtime was only 2.2 MB, this is a >>real drag if this is the way it's going to have to be... Cycling? >>>Why? The runtime itself for 4.6 is 18 megs. This isnt 'compiled' >>>software, but a repackaged runtime that loads only your patch? Im >>>suprised the standalone was 15 megs ;)
      -- Dan Nigrin Defective Records 202 Hack / PC-1600 User / VSTi Host / OMS Convert / Jack OS X http://www.defectiverecords.com http://www.jackosx.com
    • Aug 16 2006 | 8:58 pm
      On Aug 16, 2006, at 1:12 PM, Dan Nigrin wrote:
      > Using Max/MSP 4.6 on a MacIntel, I was shocked to find that after > turning my patch into a standalone application, its size was 30+ MB. > > To debug, I made a patch with nothing in it, built it into a > standalone, and that is 15.1 MB. > > Something don't seem right.
      UB requires much bulkier apps since there is code for both platforms in the same executable leading to ~2x the size. If you look inside the package you can find out specific file sizes:
      MaxMSPRuntime: 10.8 MB
      Frameworks/MaxAPI.framework: 0.7 MB Frameworks/MaxAudioAPI.framework: 0.4 MB (can remove if you're not using MSP) Frameworks/MaxJSRef.framework: 0.9 MB (can remove if you're not using JS) Frameworks/JitterAPI.framework: 4.1 MB (can remove if you're not using Jitter)
      Resources/MaxMSPCFMSupport.pkg: 0.3MB (can remove if you don't need CFM support)
      So a minimal UB standalone will be at least 11.5 MB.
      -Joshua
    • Aug 16 2006 | 9:20 pm
      At 1:58 PM -0700 8/16/06, Joshua Kit Clayton wrote: >On Aug 16, 2006, at 1:12 PM, Dan Nigrin wrote: > >>Using Max/MSP 4.6 on a MacIntel, I was shocked to find that after >>turning my patch into a standalone application, its size was 30+ MB. >> >>To debug, I made a patch with nothing in it, built it into a >>standalone, and that is 15.1 MB. >> >>Something don't seem right. > >UB requires much bulkier apps since there is code for both platforms >in the same executable leading to ~2x the size. If you look inside >the package you can find out specific file sizes: > >MaxMSPRuntime: 10.8 MB > >Frameworks/MaxAPI.framework: 0.7 MB >Frameworks/MaxAudioAPI.framework: 0.4 MB (can remove if you're not using MSP) >Frameworks/MaxJSRef.framework: 0.9 MB (can remove if you're not using JS) >Frameworks/JitterAPI.framework: 4.1 MB (can remove if you're not using Jitter) > >Resources/MaxMSPCFMSupport.pkg: 0.3MB (can remove if you don't need >CFM support) > >So a minimal UB standalone will be at least 11.5 MB.
      Thanks Joshua - but I'm still puzzled by the much greater than ~2 fold increase.
      Also, beyond the sizes for the framework and the "repackaged" Runtime, my "app" (within the MacOS folder in the package) is now 10.7 MB, compared to 2 MB when built using Max/MSP 4.5.7 on PPC...
      Dan -- Dan Nigrin Defective Records 202 Hack / PC-1600 User / VSTi Host / OMS Convert / Jack OS X http://www.defectiverecords.com http://www.jackosx.com
    • Aug 16 2006 | 9:31 pm
      On Aug 16, 2006, at 1:53 PM, Dan Nigrin wrote:
      > Right Trond, but that's why I was suprised to see the ~5 fold > increase, not ~2 fold...
      You're neglecting the fact that the Mach-O version uses a different compiler and executable format which has the potential to create larger executables regardless. This isn't particularly under our control or going to change any time soon, so it looks like you have a choice between ticking with CFM/PPC, ot upgrading your server bandwidth.
      If you recall the quad FAT format of NeXTStep (Motorola, Intel, PA- RISC and SPARC), it doesn't seem like binaries are going to get any smaller as long as one is compiling machine specific code for multiple processors.
      -Joshua
    • Aug 16 2006 | 9:31 pm
      Hi,
      Maybe you should remove header files from the frameworks copied into built application? This is not saving much space, but it's quite useless...
      Chris
      > MaxMSPRuntime: 10.8 MB > > Frameworks/MaxAPI.framework: 0.7 MB > Frameworks/MaxAudioAPI.framework: 0.4 MB (can remove if you're not using > MSP) > Frameworks/MaxJSRef.framework: 0.9 MB (can remove if you're not using JS) > Frameworks/JitterAPI.framework: 4.1 MB (can remove if you're not using > Jitter) > > Resources/MaxMSPCFMSupport.pkg: 0.3MB (can remove if you don't need CFM > support) > > So a minimal UB standalone will be at least 11.5 MB. > > -Joshua > > >
    • Aug 16 2006 | 10:11 pm
      On Aug 16, 2006, at 2:31 PM, Chris wrote:
      > Maybe you should remove header files from the frameworks copied > into built application? This is not saving much space, but it's > quite useless...
      These are useful in the case that developers want to use these frameworks, so these will in all likelihood stay. Free to delete them yourself if you like. Since they are text files they compress quite nicely for download.
      -Joshua
    • Aug 17 2006 | 6:18 am
      On 16-Aug-2006, at 23:31, Joshua Kit Clayton wrote: > If you recall the quad FAT format of NeXTStep (Motorola, Intel, PA- > RISC and SPARC), it doesn't seem like binaries are going to get any > smaller as long as one is compiling machine specific code for > multiple processors.
      Plus the last mail I had from ADC indicates that Quad UBs are the immediate future for Mac OS: 32 and 64 bit for both Intel and PPC.
      I will admit to being a little surprised about seeing 64-bit PPC included in the announcement, but it's there in 12pt Lucinda Grande.
      I'm looking forward to the first multi-GB Max/MSP standalone. Or maybe not.-)
      -- P.
      -------------- http://www.bek.no/~pcastine/Litter/ ------------- Peter Castine +--> Litter Power & Litter Bundle for Jitter Universal Binaries on the way iCE: Sequencing, Recording & Interface Building for |home | chez nous| Max/MSP Extremely cool |bei uns | i nostri| http://www.dspaudio.com/ http://www.castine.de