i have created a live looping tool and want to share it…
it’s not finished now, altough after playing for a while i get some quite good sounds out of it.
i also would appreciate tips for improvement.
----------begin_max5_patcher---------- 13186.3oc68s0iiiiklOmCv7evvU8P20jYz7NE2FX.14GPCzOWnQAGoUDo2x gcr1Jxp6cvl+1GIQJacWjxxxGZyDHcXYKayyUdHOGd99u+2+29zxm2+OiOtb w+qE+5hO8o+6zW4S4uV1q7ohW3SKea0+7qaWcL+FW9V7wiqdMd4mMuYR7+LI +M1+d7tSu56qR9521r60e6P7WSz+.Dk3IzmWPij4+I+QbzSnE+iSenCwGi2k rJYy9cYeFbwar6i21+Qx13jiUdY8qk7udOV+Krb44uqW1uKY2p2xemk+uOrY 01SisMq0i2m++7Edzx19wKMpELV9.k00fN6G53l+e4+PXR56edLuYWwPlj+h +++2+2x9a5e97kytee6Gu1G6lhhxFrL8enTPvtwCxtQkY2zYmcuK9ORGnM41 e+XxO5iayn3btMim8mHwS7OuffFA2VzI293lW2kwVK+rr+ucywjr+tYW9ebV nLnLgGkSTcSZ1ISJd0iq9dAI8S+srQrl2lRH6Ws9ica9+9Qb5n6yKR+wV9WS olIWVdbwg+Ux2di0m7TpJQy7by9QINQtIKXnAMPDHsQApqQlURC7z6PBK5ig FwH4iaU9.lloDcq8FwXCwrkZmmXNqqQ8sx6eTu7ZB5LuFGAAO+L9fJ1ZuLFd cai5aEu1FGEm30PPuVXqSjS7ZNPll03Zl1KGWqaL2tloCNOISv7RWyRAGZtl oCpBywXez0rjQglqYpbPE6HkW5Z1LRAjqYpxVmHP00LoONtYwxysqYBcHtJQ H8RWyBEFZtlICF0LEy7QWyBgBZtlICNMHQQ7QWyE6pFfbMSj15DAptlw8ww4 Bwsv0LdvI7hH9omYLEZdlwCtY1XhxG8LyKOKHL7LiGzaAFI8QOyF+Dfxyrkt PtY9kOtcy53C8xU4Ts6MMyM2Ir.csXqmHUdzYZsbZXNqA7661+7W2uc+A82B 5Ikhf4xOuH2crdWh5ZXVdpQtddEBoK5648GR4Qk9ovlu6yOb9lmHW6VHWh.k bg1kbAeRZXsHgwQtJRJK8UQrz33K+raiDRPhfjDhLgRHAyOMZDbPIRPSnHIh cYFMMd10PB8btLoeYDUOMNQXhRMepQAdDBIlSIjtwyN+6s5vqlRM47qUVNN3 Zck4hChV1H0KXnpvoBCVU7pwu8b75JTXACTyjK3xowIrYa72iObrFG4SKcXP jJ9dsaK152418e820CNzoWcc7KN86kU3Mm+.npZ8Mu0M65Rxm+Su5isI+VGA LU8FdY0WiaLxO8tsGW2mV95gMq2uKuXgp7Yyd8hexe0X5k8XoQe9sra06s8w S1ue6yqN78MG27713pTUp8zpcadaURbxF8fhfN+I2716GxpchJecuEmrZ8pj U0TXqUwTkUdpX2V8MpY+908u8VbVwZT5FNEb9eDW8MZsVSP5UIiMqhKiSIKy o5y7tm0zOPL40sXEQK65GrrUqdBbcoS00fsr9l5ITsgZcmle5riSyS+70QXr 9v+ZHgAMJprvfcyDFJaDFbSM3I6avBTggMVFF2FQharkgvJggtlwtasLjzxB iamkgzFgAUotqsLP5Xfk234LNWGP8JLn54LD2oVF5EPUHLtcVFVILHHQIgwc mkAsntytwyYvn1HLv5xn7t0xvTdL7a7bFLhUBCj2ZXbH983UCZav0EihfUhP uEhCL0J4gDwOst2tFrf01X+66e4kAEHHJPDHV4sRHOKPza1o2HP99pCCFSES .DgAyJgAqj0AxqDFGeONd8fycnyRL.DGVEVk.6s1Fu9T9fZH4AkCD4gcqFOx akGVNYtdQUB8NUcCkGDqVPNGitymLmIgh.wpMxkEgtmmLmfAhvvpMx0jc+62 IyMq73lKNnHqDGDzc9j4lEdb6kGX61MWzc9j4r7MpVPt0AWQrx9fhu2WYNSQ Ah.wJCDRzc8Jy07e.HLrZeqLUO486j4Rn3rxpcshPt2WYttZh.f7vpMtBqfr 7H8q+43A8HkRp5b9o0sLMRnKgmSJ+VMpMOSyf44U6dcYSNkkhGrUhGIketXI 6hvREAad6i2ZUYoC4VJWt3iTpbslAI5Ka2m9KTgz+lo.wxl7YiV5Lj.GaNHu 5.m6RucxD3oC5USgHm6vVIaD4ngE4OMBgN9InHzsKj7zI6Qkk3DOQhKbH0ZO JRbKC5GiMG+ViWcewHW5Px6tmD4sLW8IQtUQxhwlnkLBbrWLMdjC4ixZw8W3 tKs4.QV+5gUa1YSjxXroCfo8oSodg7V4P9tLxap+G1lcAhqLjJg4Owgirx.l yPg3vaouCpOIyHhOEFNxkj.EBCuhAtIRUi.2WhBG4PNwCQgW0DWu8hEtz8kf vwNjz8PP3UZ2C3xxa+HFbhCoQNDCd0NrJsjCcOIDbpCYo9QKDbgoY3PjdTH3 VY+RYgsBusBOzrS3buJDbpCotMDBd090Epr.2SBAGwbnRVBgfW6fBQJ6R2WL w4NTpLgPvqbNjDkk2dQH3HgCE+QHD7VpTciCc+HDbjzgZK49ID7Zc8wpkGD5 IlsYwVp6wLMalh8zGuFpWd4nHTVcv1UOIpiF43LxTI1lmXHvT4dBSkaaE1.A lpvKXpXaSuMDXoRufkl5b21bHaXppFMB3YjoFAElZ0VYdUdZFNvkO2+fLVrz nmZZJd0Zc3NyXunHNjpwwbwyJy8W9wvrUhoUHoq4ARC.+yY9Z8dAoib1HjOn 19K+HcUbCxbQLylCxJ06PtoLWLTXt4e2suRk3WdIkEtHq6btcvPXUpStBRej W73j4usLyqZneUXPUXcEUsuoO37W9i3D1x4XmbZ0.W2kcnlNDsUNNmiMjIh5 CdPi+mueXA9K+7KCGNEQ2RJHlYn3Wtw934sLnvasTIEo2RQiRpdSjAgRJ2Kl lOaaHsVA0rKH1wjwVvjGMyELKjpZaPePFn4DtgZ10hcbmwbx7+DuAUa+iKyR kNT8u5VDB1fsMsMo4sRg98EGS9HIwBQBpnjYL.kbGogcFCwR08xt56rpIaPo maY403ic25xyeyx3EVtdZNOwbjkox5KFsiFSd96To4ja42l8Mn7S2dylTdig QuMp7F2TilUdi6naYYmMs7SuW+Mt7y2V6Mubsld2Mv7Bantah4ZMtVZj4Zir NZl4EeuUan40UsZX+17FFJP9tOm145L5rHoqpKBtNmqei0tyfPyuk1.89gic uQ76aW7et3vh0ad4kkUtqRtAq4J7xYoMcMV083WRsiv1vxorx3GeGY7XT77V l42B+j0ELjks84a2cYKwAT+c+1l0q0VaXvHq9OrUVoas7l8j0L0LfDUT+WT0 tmpdJ2kt6WQ7qimrtDUkaVsWfuLCEBEFdKkaRmbbcIHbS337KfiWPhPgk2ZY 70ESmnws0aBSWbAL8yD4rw10jn8t4oDgaLUTO7JY+7Jb+g2j9ibqUOayfGec T8ZawcMVD8EEt3lcfwZuQ0c04xn47aTn4pKfWmSdK9BeQx9EbvvzyqypE0Kz p9cGbKVSD5B37mpkrEnujkT7Yi22R546opGFRcWezDNC+eWNa+hCyFiur3rA y5dZKu9CHOvZ7phimt09zby+GiL4xVl57s.mj8u951XWr.n2.GOzk.gcMnyD 85kV7yXWVTHO2chAze.hSEl+u38AEV4K05CqkVHVIok.CIoE+APZs5s2SWll kBKBiCVgk39eKLecUR7OVfW3TrUBCVqOcyk24R2bThI8eI1yejjX2d3TDZEa xmnuiPqJyoibbiIfnx+6ea0w8G9gUtoJVOA8bkVAKUe08uyp7B15O8mXLbFH Xt3ur3m2f+y+xO+B4O6hHTGc.lMgKE4xSVF5NP503.pMP5vD5hoy5LW1jJyz LJAQ6nmhjHdTzma8Ys5YL4vlieckNM8nmTVsDnOOQq8jzbR2RGPsFZcUPi9T xRj9O4ma8YsRpvbcsCYyaJVnej55EwQYmACBewWRCXAsvgTuRza+PwLl2bG2 kjjXcsyDoPXkHuJZLOqUgXY0mKaqKnPvmQK8.8Zwm53tspq0T68sitPSXpmr 8QCxncMeBFFMatXzr6EFsykhftVTYn4hSyuW3z46ZjCUffdyGnp4hQKtWXz0 .xkAp4.c.eymKZ4x6iHg9kzXdPNDdMxQ97X2+eGEGQOdqzQ2zMr2C9c2BcT8 sPGzLuPmRczCU5+.h0eyCS0.gEHE8zgl.pRUOGbqwT1pndUqd5FpXgAyrJNn WoiBRe.n5.KodLzqvA8pITuxD1mT2KBXOv5Ujfd0DpWY1HBcvUOzyC1bSnfz dEW6XpscytAOlZ4R6rab.Mmi6+3vWKXpE6I5hVnm0wGS1r6zQP7WOUb0scym WRQSSlMqeeeZnwGKNAdi2tX7zH1EZrKNRo0MAQhLqrllShLqMtj0cbhxWzrR d5haC0ymYpGSgD0KlWpmvgjrOZZI9gbgwPPRxScg3w9o+6tF18Hgw9m+akyR ROjHcJZCL9QHbCzk5MV6CBWzvkNe0sQDGMuTeVqPMif0qVtf7yt5lP9T2bHG 4mZ3HmHRkeFPsx4YcH9GQ5jupth1.3pqT2l0Q3mDoaRRteRjt43g4mg65DQR T94THt4cMxKmBwIZj5mNWcZqGnDujFcZykn94pVbZ6CoH+zoiyKMA6eyd3DM dojHik2izwZ3BhJnmtxCV80E6LpXsmFpmotwTuSDumt4JNs8B94TpXWIwIzD FiE1qDW9Fx3Ek6Ouq9d75eKc.F+0jeaURxgMO+QhNMlswGrtcjZU2OcnuD65 JpseG89C+518OuZqog0dZDrrBWZF.Of1QeAwzBM.s1YfK2LiTi.f.zeoK1r6 8OtFnDPyNSVeHUAybNgshYg5DM1PcyGvcwG1eUH+KEgzTZTvC.XjDScu.PZQ 5xGD.7TN5dAezhXJnvSI2GviVjtYI.ANJ8dAczj51FO..GMN6dBbzhPD.gMZ bw8A1nEgYvBZz3x6FnQSZ1.AvfLZ7HOCYznCwhER9bgLZb03QFM5sBYzhHQf DXzDn6KfQSoOEZP.WzDX+BWzj5kiCNXQSPtefEMi5IXPEMA0uPEsB9GbAEMA yFPQiomn7N.TzjBNvvDMINfIZALQKfIZALQazrz.lnEvDs.lnM4hp.lnEvDs .lnEvDsq.aOfIZSbvhALQaBr1CXh1MfoGvDs.lnM9vrCXhV.SzFsLIfIZALQ qUVd.SzBXhV.SzBXh13lJOfIZALQKfIZALQKfIZ2zoZBXhV.Sz9T.SzZwlOf IZcp9DvDs.lnMYL5.lnMSL5.lnMWb5.lnMSL5.lnMGQBEvDs.lnEvDs.lnEv Ds.lnEvDs.ln4K5UALQKfIZALQKfIZlOa.SztTZLfIZALQKfIZALQKfIZALQ KfIZALQCTgaDvDs.lnEvDs.lnEvDs.lnEvDsAHx.lnEvDM+w6Z.SzBXhluPi ALQKfIZiXyvBXhV.SzlUS3.lnEvDs.ln4LlnIM8PpYCRzjjKDRzn2JHQyfPE SBhnIoiCPznvCPz3JDPfEopG3BeFPz35CEDD3oh6E.QiqqXNHvSk2G.hF2Tm q.fiFcu.HZLcU3A..Qintm.DMlFzC.BfnQQ2G.hFSofEfnQw2M.hFSiaBvAP znDOCPzFLLK5YGAWa.QiRGOfnQtU.hFWC5MfCPznr6K.QSHvPAPznb+BPzXT BHADMp39APzLpmfAPznR+BPzJ3evEPznQ1.HZD8Tj2A.hFyz24fCfnwDA.QK .HZA.QK.HZilkF.Ds.fnE.DsIWTE.Ds.fnE.Ds.fncEX6A.QahCVL.HZSf0d .PztAL8.fnE.DswGlc.PzB.h1nkIA.QK.HZsxxC.hV.PzB.hV.PzF2T4A.QK .HZA.QK.HZA.Q6lNUS.PzB.h1mB.hVK17A.QqS0m.fnE.DsIiQG.DsYhQG.D s4hSG.DsYhQG.Ds4HRn.fnE.Ds.fnE.Ds.fnE.Ds.fnE.DMeQuJ.HZA.QK.H ZA.Qy7Yup.hl2z7ECcWyPWRsSZ7gtO39P2BjeD5w0OB8p7GgdN+i.1A7HfAD ODf4wCArr7P.vNOFPkzi.nW8P.eYOD.Q2CAjB9P.NjO3..5CN5u9H.vuOFP0 7CAna+H.e5QNKHuHZjgx6N3Q40Nj16T9E2FArXZI9gzhIbFjnd97R8TLERTO alodIjj8NFGBwKCnl3T3FWe22A.Qya.DMFVLu.hFSdg.hF4VAHZFDpXR.DMV z3.DMB7.DMhjCEXQhcu.HZDsNFD3oz6E.QifUPgmRtO.DMyts.ANJ9dAPzv5 C0CD.DMz8DfngkD.AHZX08AfngiXvBPzvQ2M.hVdq4.R.hFV5Y.hFdXbQYtv Cspc.K2vCM7sBOzvpHPhGZX98EdnQYBnfGZXlegGZXrDj3gFld+fGZF0SvfG ZXhegGZE7O3hGZXrM3gloxtuovgVKcPg9ZHHshxm5UUwiH8b7LcQbfFmZrxF dNlbFVv5ZnZK3oMyRiV.tjViAyzCLu0hCqfDP0YoAi6URiZcVjVkD5is7MWR HsQRHJYWf7JIQi9CUqyYvggUA29IF7QqhWepdSQq0cNNh.BgAyFgAjkE8EKZ x21br.QOGbORQ5HozATot7f9yh2e7aT5HC0udZwMike5ukMZpvNVr7ul8vO8 2ydLd2Z8qTJK6yZJiMretPNC6axH11joe6RZ1lhZuseniIVGeIUdwtI5Wmsy 9JjKwfRrJHT9o0rzMc0QeHpOuMkZaBUAt0avdKzO3u0S9DwZuPc4rcxD2Sy9 RnP1GbkQdiFVd+zHj33mfhD2tkMZJygBwMwKD2QtrHyGE4skKL0TCFEty8C6 6HGVF68j7tkYn6Ff+5oVFJj1XOXxap8qMyZQ8W3tKo4.QNeBu8rrFKLtx6.v ugkrVX8R+LhZp+GkVeqV78El1Y+fxZiiaSHrQcD85LlFcV2oXquUiKaPnwG5 rpoeYSVBvObrEU2OsrzTb4N6zqiioz0vgrd0Fk0Cr1t+q+d75VKKZm+11+d7 t11thhGZ412rqtwHx8h+d3R311ZM+0CaVueW1.q42Q16ULD9UiwXST3Rea6V 8dWeMI62u84UG99liadV2MzpJCSMgVkZIuJINYidfV01LUi6s2OX7LV8MdKN Y05UIqJpk+5euC1SwtVnYLS6z5V.yqWDVF+et3vh0alS7KenFb8WRsirCf+L sR4HTOSZLJddWnWti8636enX5+vVYkoYjq29YSVXAjnh5+hpAvrZmwaho2SV WhptRRfi9xLTHTX3srP8t26UwMiiyu.NdAIBEVdq69Y26PB6lwzEW.S+LQNa r8lmvr9cySIB2Xpnd3URGQXxpg2j9ibqUOayfGecT85DKx5pTQbNbwM6.i0t qPU0MHzb0EvqyIuEeguHY+BNXX54aSkifw1sXMQnKfyeZq3Vf9R1gdBNPpsS vybAT0BInzFeYwYCl08z1A2Z.4AVi8j7IDHllj1FOl3I.iUx9WecarKV.zaf iG5RfvtFzYhd8RK9YrKKJjaJlLH4Tg4+KdePgU9Rs9vZokFbqMRKMfFBEoE+ APZs5s2SWllkBKBiCVgk39eKLecUR7OVfW3TrUlx9WBCXjtyi4peJwd9ijD6 1CmhPqXS9D8cDZUmGVaK1XBHp7+92Vcb+geXkaph0SPOedZgkpu592YU9wx8 O8mXr7yW+h+xhedC9O+K+7Kj+rKhPczA3oDSXu7jkgd7.DVrH5LRH+PhHr8B whXHCmYymMuoVg9QpqWDGs.iQD9hujFvBZgCodkn29ghYLu4NtKIIw5ZmIRg vJQdUzXdVqBwNaEUNKhoPvmwfnp9qNtaqBx7hq5z6E3q207IXXzr4hQytWXz NWJB5Szg8.m9kxo42Kb57cMxgJPPu4CT0bwnE2KL5ZGP8Ap4.c.eymKZ4x6i Hg9kr1JlCgWibjOO18+2QwQzi2Jcznyr8dvu6VnipWL+91g32pz+4cP9sIr. o3gGxuQAnjeJ0qzQAoa0UczoLdLzqvA8pITuxD1mFbynrGX8JRPuZB0qLaDg L5gedvlaBEj1q3ZGSsLPxYnio1cCZ5DfEo.xWEP8r.h24.0+Pi0gOBfY4iAr j9P.vrOBPE7CNZP+XCE3ODv8dWRsNHRkeFPsx4YcH9GQ5jupth1.3pqT2l0Q 3mDoaRRteRjt43g4mg65DQRT94THt4cMxKmBwIZj5mNWcZqGnDujFcZykn94 pVbZ6CoH+zoiyKMA6eyd3DMdojHikCClXCbIInmtxCV80E6LpXsmFpmotwTu SDumt4JNs8B94TpXWIwIzDFiE1qDW9Fx3E0v3i0+V5.L9qI+1pjjCad9iDcZ LaiOXc6H0pte5PeI10UTa+N58G90s6ed0VSCq8zHXYEtzMBGSP3oE9Wasw.W tQwMFzLQ+ktXyt2+3ZfDrMaLY8fEwLlCP9RWfMHmuzNLwoLWX+Ug3ee0t3sC Q6BtoqyDU5DRKlJze5v9O1stYqUt6Nwzv39jAnNEMPDoZEzAByEQ4mVLbDih YYOK8uTIM+YRFGOqX6ncRCYt.fa5UvyuzfZGjZnkAO.xiHs0A6VYcvrx5fpd PrOj5I03hak8AyJrjkGAE6iyejlUUVIYTaQtVVR0RZDZt8AcDupJK.dQ06r8 fU6IV7A0xFAEHbhB3fiBjVKBZkVAgLP5jLfAOY.2dYfDnx.tSx.J7jAB6kAb fJChbRFPfmLPZuLHBnx.kSx.L7jAQ1KCTvTFfrlDjXfFUAxIJ.dQUvT1qEg. pkL1IY.7hpfirWFfApkrxIY.7hpfSrVFf.p2TLwIY.7hpfSs2Nf.TY.0IY.7 hpf6vpLofTFPreMZHFLo.6WgCBlqvgX+5CP.UKx9nqQvb2VH1GYGBn6UAx5Y zXBXt9.DyIJfCPJf6DEv.HEPchBn.jBDNQAD.RARmn.3EWjxssKZTNSSs035 hyQ26FPQpSWdUItHqkNQvbttHqMPhfYHeQVOSWznmqVoxUm3514HEgJt55RY VO+QDLWQTj0SgGM5fwKjFTSWlBIwmt75RbX6CRDla+WDZFnfz05FkIPXTM7o gzMHg7KAxzNQXe2yL8RsdHFvsifLmU3VuDyImt4qKoacbmQHXFySjSDvHi4Q GjSgmOrFLvqeoPc5Rt4xqax0re+rgY9Mcf.j9NAH7cBf66D.LCpV5VBQFEAH 0sKHyR1jR17rhMg0AkJf49qJrdxQALCrgas0gXzVGhH14Uroh3yxB1DVa0vg YgwHrdMMhQmEQivvDlhjKlmkqwsufYfoYOWd8IfHBszZ0jT07rTMoa1MdsKY zEZ2XVKVjhUZkY0thJmmkoIrdCD3RXVHfXmHfwEliNvFi+tHMnOV6J8ZzLVe W+knwsdmE3vL7TGH.puS.Dem.PdNAvfYQqQs14Kg66Dfv2I.ouS.Q9NA.SiX l0dgnids7Ld4sIliJuKwEWoC.I6pYI.DJyIxFdANRsdwXzwuEFxxolgKKmJl ZWQlo7xvrmrgYXKTqC3mMZOdFqHyhnYjYJemTx0mzttDf0k6.Ubg1TFueL1L Uq.TgS1M.zem0avAczJWYS6bZKaMBpq9V15fibfFEs06qIElAgxbq9FGWHPj xUGnIfnqeplrdxFftFe6mrjM9xCpbR.wr4JIfNQY.zerSie3UUyQQNQ.vqz3 iTNQ.v6zInPNQ.vqz9UDmH.HdB3st7KA5Q1z9C9KLSi.1g9gxnWMXo5Pfxmm 5Pv9iRKFl4ky9dl03OIsFgQQ4RRlo5Pv9F4DGnsfmnqOAfUzJ0L9LUGB1GvK TaQU16Qleg1MlsdjHJW4A0tBMS0gf8MlKLLq6JFyIBXb1Trx0gPlEFpwUlZE WMS0gf8MRJBLShLw5fnAZaEzdA.LKkTh0dro9t..lqAfX8LNJjuKA7dUHf1y Vr+vdAyDWQr+XtN8UgPwaT7pl+ZHM83tTmk1PHU6nzOafkghN1baMTZZjpHV 77+vzUHbod0bmcS5ZcRZVwK2.3Ddd0tWSYPs+2y+NqN75ItRwqUtySSV11Hp bywlqq1gbTLPFk28okjxjRqnQvx32dV2zqwUXTwGJzTJTSV9xlsweO9vw58U 6kNLHp03qyag2me.U6N2t+q+dsNxcFjc3zu292i20FRBfZ9Clcqa1UWhW4mt WvHoe3DwFLOY4qG1rd+trAR0Oa1qW7Slx1zIVnBHUnukcqdusOdx98aed0gu u43lm2FWU5kZGsZ2l2VkDmrQOnHnyexMu89gMZfp37K9Vbxp0qRVUSgM+6py tLtkcB92hOdb0qwUZz5Iw+SMTYfeZvdDutgqS4Zz7HpIi5SNh7I0v7j9AalJ 1rUQSgxZMpJ.ISUKSxj2b8e9ijjTc4g3bx7kMQkxRHGC5R3bUcwUm8vQKmQ. FXW7ej9i1tV0Ka2uJwR1CSiAAzblDVdIrG8O6X0t3DfnckRFo+B1ZWp0tzHp wPrORkPJxDWUvLgHIhGE84VeFt92bxgMG+5JsuOzSJKDLetUEXGDPTa.KB8L XEyi0tMmsx1o2poWmw61e3sUaSGWK9YrsVOZ3URCfG2H2xYG+CPX3bgyzYJW RHLSWMXuB5yzwEn4clNgWMSmg8.mY5jd0LcE1kOPyzYErgo0pzOdGOSWg0C. loSftOloiJh.yZ5vd0LcYXT7bNSGi3UyzYXOfYlNF0qloqvt7wYlNlLLSWCq G.LSW1o+ADFN84R58E+wpuG+RJGdHNaDRWACZ7fUW+IWleowyYGWLDnFT34D JTiA1chEpkbApTWAN5s4mhy4QjL2NUwC81SbPyjGX82m8oPvlzHXUpDFNcB1 lRg9RqfkoVXnzKLTJFFNMCclpgdS2P6obnt5UCi2l2vfFwUMjSV77hMMd61f Vb895Izart97r1Peo+4H6Ooh4rqFeaCnMTyBGyW11WPWZk8LCUMGo0bld8kK GVb3ek7s2XNHZn5yHNu0IoGvKqMdZGi7fdYxCzrIOZIRhpBjiwI0hiX.wgIE 7LcrDQvPdfuL4AAL1GY9sd1Fog1pPxJsba4T51pYL3iPtH6Urn7FuVoKLYsl wXqfgSOuxBaDLX6DLWrghmHPzTu8raBlTDSTaQF8odgU95LIxx94B0e2ut+s 2h0AEsbIXzY+kEewJ255cF.yz6uxDpvNEA9PuH8UBbllMKzbKmm0HPDlrwZq F8LLMK6dQZjsHoEYhjOu3icaRV792VcL1duMJ87sHJfjM76EYCyAaDB97p1. hbPbUkC0VXcV0BOzBqaqrhaSJYyo4zsC1UOkY7.kZryJgilHktPihKkDY4cn Ik1mtd2XqbAFmqWGkelPw5oguQLErsLkKVtykmYJmYP2DBG6h1fzKU3cxnl4 kjnvERj5kjH2ERj3kjHaVIQiKWknTZRUhakaH7rNqDViYEYshf74fvEMlfRW AiIlxCxv5Yl5hM5.mQGoejNZyHQiKT5SkjlApT2R1h8QpMQ5KFFgdmtpbgdU R54xo1vTJeCY7nxm5sUeOd8ukNtSi8+2VkjbXyyejnC5s0DUZa51rJ6dC8kX WV+Z+N58G90s6ed0VSRYOMBVVgKAzDiKP5HZkzadhwoQgDiGRLdHw3gDi6MI FmFRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3g DiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLtujXbptY2i0Yt81lXbYHw3gDiGRLdHw3dSh wIgDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3KVFERLdHw3gDiGRLdH w3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRLdHw3gDiGRL9UNw3M2zsVSC.RCrbLcNY08hdx.cgdTW ottO3qn76z9drM2TtXBobpWQ4zIjxQffx6EUFxxJVpm3ONxrDlEMYESfaMqX yScfP5FT3p4f4V.+PeyT2.KOD+91TOhKd9iWd4LZQWKMw56wRlOqDXN1j22E fROiBlHa.wDdD+TEqzEsbCko8U1TZQ4ObyjQm6xHpMPjDYFfZFhZblO3ajqI 5f.iVDXbMgQOZtlLLen6ZBaEl4RUn6BWS1Zx.MWSXlW3ZpdIRzZFzJphH9M2 oj7Qymjg2yDv1mjUQKgU2GQKQrTnoeDNtj.SvR4e2CwDY4aOEmY+pWcR2tq7 +1SA2ecWbaepeIeaywhx82J1lRG+n5xU8xz5F+wbXjZb02MQyX4m9aYilJLi EK+qYO7S+8rGi2sV+Jk1bRf.OuXNAJvyKwCfAx1pdy1XqDcA8PTZzUUc4Gom KKnukv.9RsC3iwT57B7wLuB3iMrGv.7wbrWA7wEd7db.9XtUQAyZrIC2k.eb g0C..9XIyClw6X9wXMMBlA2KVEEqiFVGfrUy4gF47YbfLg1vbtiIqNjLHuKR PJw6LakwUh2I7.d2gEa2mcvSsPqiYNuzrymUlazgmFOxCO8MfyZoVoTUl2Jt k71HfvaKNT++v1r4V7mbCbdCt2w3j21uNt4xKiSxNOAMh9vg8TST9sz6TzIl cKoWq6nO54Ia2bLokkh+8jMe82a5kJ6vRjruwvt7h.qlcmBtckvsvDLWnx2v NphfEYOiQwTIssvsRGHus5vuW5aP6cs7C09HUiuq5atc0ywaaooGzahXMGlL cIOzTGH63inCGjvqHydsBcq3hHA8ys9rFDwgO1p6ACUE.waSGaoiwpwudhMh YXrr1y3HrRfaXye1HieaBHYvLvH0UZ3bDPBA6WAjLHuSvwyU.IDpOEPxvZcT vDPBQ3WAjLrVo.LAjPj9V.IEyEA3.RnvKfDp3tJfDS4WLEAjLzn99OBjAS3J GylqHPDL+JBjA4cLFath.Qv8oHPFVqiHgRDHBOKBjg0JEDnDAhv6h.onfs.b DHD3EAhPYQDHoyTxjdQDHEReai.AGBAomPPFLeWTDZtBAgI7qPPFj2QnyVHH LuJDjg05vfIDDBwuBAYXsRNXBAgv7.dq8MhYbDsDm8l1HlE3PiXNzHlCMh4P iXt5vEvMhYbnQLOOxiPiXNzHlCMh4OEZDygFwbnQLGZDygFwbnQLGZDyfV1D Pn3djCgFw7TSj9dOLLzuK+Tn+ndi6OpOv8L2GfNh7CPes9An6j+.zi4eXwO. uGMIBMhYHzHlst17vBvWadUSIddUmU6DxgXRDWWH9meFGoZqOL.hZ6qZRN79 SWvU3rEfdRoDHYaRvm2eXc7gpJ.DJmn4UMd1kUcf4b77ZBjJIbd0mcCpNP6Z rqXaM6APOTDSdzZhhFlOzahh7k1Z568sPQasWfVKTDLM0UaAA.zDBB.pIDD. NO.ZtQrk3FsEVeYdRiv4y5H30VHSWKhA0HX9NBju4lnDo2z7b+IxH8FrU4Jp N2SRSs2U8Jo4Jd9FUJqtxmAUPblkj0IhsjkHFKKQvMrDcB7iLYdq7UFl.WWt m0tRZtRMOrDqURXjwxQXrxbDCAV8JCOfxYsbk4Vz7U.wQZtQAVxPtt53MESc HPUiUflUlD7ShoHD6zUvfx37ogx3QQ.ixX3ogxxZEgyBkwY1RZjQOIjY5Clt 1Sj5iKY0qHlNiupkqLa7fQMFqt1rDAxVVBczSBYl9vvD35v8qdkgIXZQC0th SJMcU0qJ1mF0LwtZal3NL6kikcccI.osDf.ASBP4jD.dSI117AcP.JPJAX1K AnvTEhZMAPfoJDwZBfASI.xII..sAhr1M5nMhMqwvLQIkVdZSyUlIJOchxJe kYpQZzLM0HyZkRFLcKvr1sPaReHP.Rmj.vyuFy9kd.ynqr2uLP0fPW+EHEgy WfDVugbEKzIRckcOQit9KzQfwm70NiKJgJu9SFwPjRRshIUt5RMo0qXGO5Mi .yH54YYkpBwpWYjnYGL94YYlVqrlA9DPLBUq8jKgYDpLlSR.3Q.B7LX4nHk7 2MaVGXx0mzfwNrRllMXEKvyyFrZ8tiAyU.LCyidc0qlgMy85F+L+5G+40cZC qSf4nm1iPKm.SLqbBLMWQMEspNvl7qfAUSUWJUizjKByNc40MPFqWQpeqOhI WnjQoJECfRAkzhSQSSgBfQL1oKgSF+uDJSUdobWcIl0qnAnSsZuON5zTrNXj blz3vVuwmXlmKbvnKT3nOUmls1QEckkL1W0bTxEV0bJyYvTueb0N6g2RJivu TJKpzFMd8EYV6ni.SOcD21xMB7H.21d.5nxMGwbfc0GvcSm5o1U5pJMUuivM Wdc8B1h3niXU4vzMdKhiNHfQu7UhL5IhRoxflVht+6QQ4kmT9UW2cGws8W.d VVBgSDvnrr3zxGE9L.DgvadX3uBzlxVqGALsdZik2AAL5n3XQksdzUQNgpsd t1QoRjNs4V.bdIgSDvnrdjLp15QWSoDUoyz5oqzGyARgk0UO8jBasrHvbaga SbzAAL57MHTksrjZIjPaYIu1AND4zttBOKKrzIBXTVVJdYKKEsv54ZGzPar7 NhlEn6oOxVqG7nmXUgJa8judOECosd5aAeEuQwqZ9qgx0jUoS9mgNqdh+VW5 XI1JlMhJ4CloJd7DY14AbsiC25xcwwq2FW8XeyYJDI67mlcTwY4HiKFoRWya 0i8cWG+xy2v2SNr5q+9lrih4YV9xhCSYpunhWpb6g6TGsLUv95gX8oFjJPsQ gkAxAIpx5kN2.FNOdrEtaxorTsxp.FbFn.gyYKJFFGo6g.bhpNaokCE50PU. ymCcAIimSyXRpVQNImoRfmCMAFdbZBBwUVS.mJyw4FHm0ItoZBH90WSPdBkr Im7OPQ7nHhq5Bu7ZGewQBRp5VNekl8uZewiRGZjdSX5Sl90SG5b2GgjtbTTt 2jT1Z5yuN5PEGW6hu1SmX+uuuWcKtV2haPW.Viynus5Vm33ceN7q1KWNK45B 6yH5SQaOisNN69SES84BPgoW2z5tRXtOIyt3IFA+i0o8UVuz3ys8my+FqN75 wZMjlpLa7PLao4PzQKcF2Y7tUTKd032dVigM3J7ny.oSQ3dcBfNKcXPzuQIp 1c1B.6TEbcr32ydX0oCH0AW9mt2FtU+sLKa5qWcAgNV.eN8AcN8AaN8CYNsB WNcBUNMgIG2aoFej5E7i16EM+s8IwK99pseDu3+ZwWVrZ85Eq1s3WOrX22+u 9GKzMXsEur+vhjus4n9Fq7E88UmawVGRoWxux9GCh.p512JFI5Cjrbnq0PK+ VqNbX+eTuqdUVAsQWbZSR7aFN7R7tLGIeN6Ax4mxN+znyOEKN+bZo6VT51wj zOv.sMLi2qV5JX4zxKGLLXTi2xU3BL6G8XaMoq7usz4q+89ZSJYo9s6t90Pb 4tBbEWBLO6RWnl3TYVXV5pRNEQAxDQAtulFTMfOa01Mu1pt00r+1LqFi7AMF obbvXzGMFkWAiQFgFLFuZFizAMFI3fwnOZLFcErEID4iksX+naaxgU6N999C C1Y3X4bYsAD2ltq2UpmGFIGWG0a5g11j8u9513gAbYdIeO5kt2j0MY8RxF3. ky8KRFJpTyhUT7XO8PU7Mh0xz6YCHXsBaXsBDZXVaKMOWcWr8ys9L7LKZ5yc R5hsOreQ1jQCH3z4WASk58D4xcmbQ8nS4ROnanZKukR4Ph2p.Cu8i2dtVWAt GMSS0Tit71HqIVqKhIhwPoKx1avDq1sd+aYIOwVtrN7K4DDNQSey9X6s1Ncz BKbfoiRuuzQK3x.QGkAEcT65izFtWVQMewsQ5p3w9E1Fou1Dtw01zP3BPP3V FLNBLwhyrIV7x6O9MZUN84nJa2upkQ3NSqttiiJx03DpKe5fV1WH68TMxISw 0ggHyX4m9aYilJbiEK+qYO7S+8rGi2sV+JtTpfVJexGcVx80gaam8tS6LRW3 Idsc2.ZtCvREX7GnH13PnJplCOOB1t.vhBLBJK.jBkHWl0jRfGLoDQ59ko.1 4j.q8uZddRa4pfT5VHktEV4zYrtzySZK2FQktknR2R4bdj970kuHo0rgPKOf nkGQkyShn7XRTdPkmAkxWrtxUMBhOKaIie65fXxYRcwWgfJJlvzmcpdMKdVC BxpL6nXWgT6nWjFkERsiCSWH.0VwpPOjyVPFb1BYn1t7wLXqvWA+bTzCVFrs ZaQOUX8fZaQkn6qsEsfKCisEUh8qstW.wrKwY2WpnBHkbIN0u13dwDt80nHO Zi6MN1lHJWABJ+8U6h2NXjklS7GubsovufPKQMqlkFehC6+X25ZmWlZLQpaf aKtsiTSKQBIxNYf4GLvHCTcm9LLVJz3Ec1ARbV2xOmjQQ.SFQrZmUMlVOLhI BFZhIqrknpGKqIBCZhIqRboA7AAfX5ZAIy48BSeFaYk1N9Ufb7GY8vGln0Tj 8sytQ2uwx6Le51pHSPKt.HjEeJHKJgALxRQlB5BqgqX.QWrKirzGnkyO+51D vwV6b.AS..h54PTozdDLBlPQgx51fqBlscOExywYVk01.RXhSQ1iW54aBEDs hQ1SApGTrh5pC.IHqmGCfl.dNrUXOJvAytGoCXSA2uwTLLLMfUdN1fXcSWFl HJr+i0g1GCwzGE2TzeWe9ijj8mpuqykmzwj8uu38sq9W82L43FDKS2QxZoBs ctSONPofUMCYrAaIezpsKvVFfSTq2qZEs29gaQ2R4UQWMdU0lrW4Fd.e3lWn ojGQnqLmpZB5Omb90q95O5k+QxK1YgtxkLmUhYnyOFwrnwOJ0CMRWCMqZ7ij qn1mhkW0e51i+Lq7MbmyDGI0kcq7Fo70nElzJOTVt2YhwZrgXLbwHKadl5VU aqOowcUUYyB8Zh0hEorSB9JqXObSmtbmFl2rKfNEcZ3hxUWcpmS2VyU109Lr Rvjn7hnr4yt39LLMZb8YX4UtMCyO0bkwmNVC3VNVCSk89awGOt503lF7eca7 pdCsQe1yXZO6TRi76d4NLc1hkhrvhUGIFg10vto3KUpvxxiadBcYY41slrn8 Z4cpLwe4iceMmG1ivfX5g3Z+Pj7oxhHVIMxCkthNHMOS1YTq7TiSmFEQn7l5 fs0vianT25WXacL7NbQTTD5MJBykq2+1pM4zCury0x5DbKzIpTpBsw8pkpeh LqQpW1SG5IloYnWgfZoOC0Y0n2QCYd05Jq1Act6H+YCQatzrbmQohsce5Odu AWpqbMy5D3iO9Hxvx5ZxX6r8kCGDJZHRnxb03m3Jd5D7W495d4yoxpOR1+s3 su+aog5+a4dha3V9XxpCIKV8w5M6WV0d6C8JSIsxF53VZomRnsEDF+i4KEiR u9KhPMr3yr7FcUi11HaNDeUp8oJBubIyerY2erd+e7aUus13y5oOEXc5xKTM uDF84Zhhz5lALLG1bZWJZldsLlrN1lVb7kclX35YAN8rroUYRWBsQeaUqEJi nq9tSUH.alVhpaKXWULP0bRzxtQ0wNQ0pdk8CNNjGbL.O3nVIVo3ayfSB4Am BvCNhUbtZnG3rM3DPdvwf7fylwFVcSFaXIjGbQ.dvEQsYvEQbcvoRiCIawU3 7CblJhc5poYXa0jtQrai.uVx85x8bjqiNcwmh4BCbLUbwDNpoCFq.1cUg7AZ wwzQT4P6HJAxsXt5oZXb6TPRjAIImcnJwOEkscHhyTBlchJmvwNdnwtv4wNK 5IrH8eQmF6B0zNz4Vo96rdDEKyFmLV9pWXZDCM+poYTGccF0H9UcTKtNiZod Tq2v0hQMkLkiZ7jOpYTZtcIickG5joenm5zKyrjKtxCc5jOz4bjs5JYuP5e9 e.Ij0KuA -----------end_max5_patcher-----------
Surely Max/MSP is to do stuff no-one does yet…
Anyway… aren’t there more imaginative things you could spend your time on?!
Keep going with it, Schmonsky!
See, this just makes me sad:
jg, if you had bothered to check you would have noticed that it clearly
does a wide variety of things not possible in Ableton Live…
Simon, would it be possible to get a walkthrough?
> Surely Max/MSP is to do stuff no-one does yet…
> Anyway… aren’t there more imaginative things you could spend your time on?!
nice work !
i just opened it and i found a little bug
outlet 2 of buffer~ linus2 is connected to inlet 2 of message object, should
be inlet 1.
2008/10/8 Andreas Wetterberg
> See, this just makes me sad:
> jg, if you had bothered to check you would have noticed that it clearly
> does a wide variety of things not possible in Ableton Live…
> Simon, would it be possible to get a walkthrough?
> jg skrev:
>> create patches to do this when they exist already?
>> Surely Max/MSP is to do stuff no-one does yet…
>> Anyway… aren’t there more imaginative things you could spend your time
hello.i’m not exactly shure what a walktrough is?
explaining all the things that it does or can do?
if you meant that i would be very interested….
thank you for the hint.
Quote: johngodfrey wrote on Tue, 07 October 2008 18:03
> Surely Max/MSP is to do stuff no-one does yet…
> Anyway… aren’t there more imaginative things you could spend your time on?!
What if you don’t own live. Why spend 500.00 dollars when
I can whip up a max patch that does what Live does.
surely???? max/msp is to do whatever the fuck you like on.
Anyone on this list who is kind enough to actually
*share* the work they do here – either because they
are "reporting" the assistance they’ve received from
others (after searching the usual places and then
bothering to ask detailed and intelligent questions
that rise above the level of "Can you send me a
patch that does what
be generous deserves our thanks. When done
well, such things inform and may inspire others.
While it may be so that beginners tend to aspire to
some collection of minor variations on things that
exist in the commercial software world already, to
claim that anyone should simply use a commercially
available program makes a variety of assumptions
about the financial status of the maker, and also
may be an unintended commentary on the imagination
of the person who advises us that there’s only one
way to do something and that some piece of software
does that already.
Funny, I had similar responses (use Live, don’t reinvent the wheel etc) about my "Zyklus Improvisor" patch (nb: an 8-track midi looper, but that’s just the basics, tracks influencing each other and other goodies are in the pipeline). I demoed Live for a couple of days, only focusing on the midi part, and was really disappointed. Too much of a hassle to do things the way I wanted and sometimes just not possible, as I found out on their forums. Surely, Live isn’t the answer to everything when it comes to looping.
Nope, it isn’t. I never said that either when I responded. I said that the things you listed can be done in Live and then I said if you want to make something that caters to your way of working and learn something in the process then you should make your own patch.
Just making sure I’m not getting lumped in with the guy from this thread, who seems to have a shitty attitude, just because I posted something remotely similar in that other thread.
The way I’m working is totally not important, but simply what I want can’t be done in Live. If Live had all (or most) of the answers I wouldn’t go into the trouble of making a fairly complex thing in Max. I would be crazy if that was the case, but I don’t think so ;)
Ableton Live doesn’t even do audio overdubbing.
Would be a mistake to call something like that a looper…
I too must admit that I’m working on a looper, simply because none of the
commercially available ones work like they should… ;)
Only on Max 4.6 so I can’t see what goes on in this example, but keep
On Wed, Oct 8, 2008 at 5:48 PM, bronswerk
> The way I’m working is totally not important, but simply what I want can’t
> be done in Live. If Live had all (or most) of the answers I wouldn’t go into
> the trouble of making a fairly complex thing in Max. I would be crazy if
> that was the case, but I don’t think so ;)
> i also would appreciate tips for improvement.
first, I’d clean up the distinction between the presentation and
patching parts. Hit shift-cmd-i to open the patcher inspector and check
"open in presentation". Also remove all objects which slipped into
presentation which you don’t need there.
Add a sub patcher with instructions how to use that beast… (I’ll wait
with testing as I have no idea what it should do…;-)
Is there some inspiration from a hardware looper maybe? Just curious…
> time to create patches to do this when they exist already?
Com’n, this one didn’t exist yet, it seems you have a prejustice against
looping. Get to one of my concerts and tell me if you’d ever be able to
do such in Live. I certainly wouldn’t be able… ;-)
> Surely Max/MSP is to do stuff no-one does yet…
I’ve seen tons of looping patches, each and every was different and you
could say this hasn’t been done like that before…
> Anyway… aren’t there more imaginative things you could spend your
> time on?!
For sure its better you don’t waiste your time turning off people who
are proud, and right so, for what they created…
If you think your stuff is better, just share it as Simon did!
Sorry, but respect is the key to our community…
in other words:
every undergrad culturally-minded american female art student (and
some males) feels the need to make a Barbie-referenced work at some
point. would you stop them, merely because you’ve seen sixteen
million of them?
every max 1 student wants to do a synesthesia project. just because
we’ve seen sixteen million of them, are we going to stop?
making loopers and vj players are great exercises. don’t stop people
from making them, just because live can do it too!
would you stop a kid learning python or c++ from writing a calculator?
On Oct 8, 2008, at 10:34 AM, Gregory Taylor wrote:
> Anyone on this list who is kind enough to actually
> *share* the work they do here – either because they
> are "reporting" the assistance they’ve received from
> others (after searching the usual places and then
> bothering to ask detailed and intelligent questions
> that rise above the level of "Can you send me a
> patch that does what
> well, such things inform and may inspire others.
> While it may be so that beginners tend to aspire to
> some collection of minor variations on things that
> exist in the commercial software world already, to
> claim that anyone should simply use a commercially
> available program makes a variety of assumptions
> about the financial status of the maker, and also
> may be an unintended commentary on the imagination
> of the person who advises us that there’s only one
> way to do something and that some piece of software
> does that already.
> knowledge is not enough/science is not enough/Love is dreaming this
wow, i love this community. there i was feeling bad for schmonsky after godfrey’s post but now… i kinda feel bad for godfrey. well, not really.
hey, schmonsky, instead of a walkthrough or even on top of it, you could also put comments in your patch when you post it here. it might help people to go through it easier. but you were saying it’s not finished yet, so it’s all good either way. again, great work.
i’ m a bit surprised that simply posting a patch creates such a discussion.i thought that this forum is about sharing knowledge and asking things about programming Max/Msp.i owe a version of ableton live myself but i want to get into programming max/msp.
(can be fun!!!)shure a looper is not quiet an advanced task, but i thought i’ll better start with something simple than the other way round.still i find it curious that people waste their time insulting other people.why don’t they make their own discussion and don’t care about ‘stupid’ beginners.
…anyway there were also positive responses for which i’d like to thank so for.
ya, Simon, you’re right, it’s strange that some people bother to post negativity. makes you wonder why they don’t have more of a life. but just wanted to point out, not only were there also some positive posts but if you take a second look, you’ll see that a majority of the posts were positive and encouraging. so please take that as being more representative of this community. don’t mind the negativity: shit happens. you’re very much welcome here. and i’m willing to bet that if not a majority, then at least half of the user-base here would be interested in seeing different ways of achieving live-looping. Best of luck to you.
thank U RabidRaja…nice to meet you.
i’ll work a bit more on my patch and then post it again when i commented everything….
It is always great when someone wants to share a patch in this
Personally I have’nt seen the perfect MsxMSP Livelooper yet. I am
working on it (or trying to !!)
Ableton Live is only good for looping if you can live with a
predefined tempo a "guide loop" or click.
I you want to simulate, or even better extend the capabilities of
pedalloopers such as Lexicon JamMan og Boss RC-50 you have to create
one in MaxMSP.
Keep posting everyone !
Den 08/10/2008 kl. 16.48 skrev bronswerk:
> Funny, I had similar responses (use Live, don’t reinvent the wheel
> etc) about my "Zyklus Improvisor" patch (nb: an 8-track midi looper,
> but that’s just the basics, tracks influencing each other and other
> goodies are in the pipeline). I demoed Live for a couple of days,
> only focusing on the midi part, and was really disappointed. Too
> much of a hassle to do things the way I wanted and sometimes just
> not possible, as I found out on their forums. Surely, Live isn’t the
> answer to everything when it comes to looping.
Quote: email@example.com wrote on Wed, 08 October 2008 11:58
> i’ m a bit surprised that simply posting a patch creates such a discussion.i thought that this forum is about sharing knowledge and asking things about programming Max/Msp.i owe a version of ableton live myself but i want to get into programming max/msp.
> (can be fun!!!)shure a looper is not quiet an advanced task, but i thought i’ll better start with something simple than the other way round.still i find it curious that people waste their time insulting other people.why don’t they make their own discussion and don’t care about ‘stupid’ beginners.
> …anyway there were also positive responses for which i’d like to thank so for.
Well I think it IS a big deal. It is about maintaining a positive
and respectful forum that encourages people to share their ideas.
Mr. Godfrey’s dismissive and negative attitude does not
reflect the general sentiment of this forum. We should always
support and encourage new Maxers to keep exploring and listening
to their creative impulses.
i’m seeing here a lot of people are developping or has developped a looper
i’ve actually developped one too which is more a sampler than a looper, does
not allow to load samples (a basic demo is here
and i was wondering what are the sensible points you faced (or are currently
facing) to realize such a patch.
- how do you sync your tracks? general audio clock, independant clocks,
– if you add some effects to the app, do you chain or parallel them?
– use of poly~, one track per poly~?
i’ll release the one i’ve done soon, it"s almost ready :)
2008/10/8 Anthony Palomba
> Quote: firstname.lastname@example.org wrote on Wed, 08 October 2008 11:58
> > i’ m a bit surprised that simply posting a patch creates such a
> discussion.i thought that this forum is about sharing knowledge and asking
> things about programming Max/Msp.i owe a version of ableton live myself but
> i want to get into programming max/msp.
> > (can be fun!!!)shure a looper is not quiet an advanced task, but i
> thought i’ll better start with something simple than the other way
> round.still i find it curious that people waste their time insulting other
> people.why don’t they make their own discussion and don’t care about
> ‘stupid’ beginners.
> > …anyway there were also positive responses for which i’d like to thank
> so for.
> Well I think it IS a big deal. It is about maintaining a positive
> and respectful forum that encourages people to share their ideas.
> Mr. Godfrey’s dismissive and negative attitude does not
> reflect the general sentiment of this forum. We should always
> support and encourage new Maxers to keep exploring and listening
> to their creative impulses.
Interesting. So it seems my red rag has attracted quite a few bulls.
Two general comments, and then some contextualisation. Firstly, my apologies that my exasperation expressed itself as an outburst directed against ‘Schmonsky’. Keep up your work – my comments are really derived from a wider perspective and should have been expressed that way. Secondly, it is to be noted that derisive criticism of simplistic programming problems on this forum is ubiquitous, without comeback, while criticism of musical outlook is apparently the result of a ‘bad attitude’.
Now the context. I have taught creative work at third level for many many years, and am actively engaged as a professional composer and specialist performer of new music. Stefan suggests I should share my work if I think it’s better: actually, I share it on an international stage already, and ‘better’ in this context is an opinion so subjective and style-dependent it’s not worth pursuing. My point is that I do not proceed from prejudice derived from an uninformed viewpoint.
We live in a culture of easy fixes. Microwave dinners mean you don’t have to learn to cook, GarageBand gives everyone a way to make music-by-numbers. Reason, Ableton and all the others of that ilk make it practical to make music by offering easy routes to the things that conventionally are done. The reason for this as a premise is obvious: people normally think in terms of convention. Ask a class of undergraduates to write a 2-minute piece in 2 minutes, and most will automatically begin by drawing a 5-line staff and a treble clef, despite the total impracticality of successfully completing the task with this starting point. Ask anyone in Western culture to improvise a rhythm, and it will almost always be in 4/4.
Here’s a specific, professional-level example: I attended the International Computer Music Conference in Belfast this year, and heard hundreds of computer-generated pieces. The vast majority were colourless montages of the same sounds and gestures. Mark Applebaum, who curated one of the concerts, wrote in his note for the programme that he’d had a serious problem choosing enough works because: "I found myself yearning for music… which is not bland, tedious, lethargic, conventional, or cynical…suggesting the most alarming and depressing consequence of a seemingly consolidated current common practice’ ". It was also notable that the tone of the conference was very much directed toward "how I did this/how we can do this", rather than the musical value of what was being done. Technology can – and does – mislead those who want to make music. (Some seemed surprised that posting on this forum received a comment about musical values: perhaps that says a lot.)
The advantages of much commercial software are easy to see – it can be extremely straightforward to create a track in the minimum time, because the software is optimised to do exactly this. This is extremely seductive: the lure of Reason means we live in an age of Reason (excuse terrible pun). There is a price to pay, of course, because the software is designed to do a narrow band of things (thus achieving its ease of use and high end-product quality), and this very restriction means a limit on one’s creativity, a limit that a user may not even be aware of.
Creativity is what this argument is all about. The software is just a tool. Thus what needs to be questioned is the *why* of doing what one is doing. Joshua asked whether I’d stop students doing something that I’d seen "sixteen million" times before: the answer is yes, of course I would. And I would spend as long as I could explaining why and offering ways to develop alternatives. Whenever we accept the conventional, whenever we fail to question our own creative outlook, we abrogate our rights as creative individuals.
And this is the root of what appears to be a prejudice against ‘looping’. Actually, it’s a rationally-derived decision to be suspicious of labels, wherever it’s possible, because the very label itself already entraps one’s thinking. This forum is packed with people asking how to make synths, samplers, drum machines, loop players et al. My problem here is not the technical issue of how to do these things – everyone needs to practice programming and they could function as the basis for further development – but the creativity of the very idea of doing it in the first place (note that I’m not directing my criticism at any one, specific, example). Of course, the old adage that there’s nothing new under the sun is mostly true: it is rare that one of us can escape our cultural heritage sufficiently to invent something never seen or heard before, but *you can try*. It should be clear now why I said Max ‘is to do stuff no-one does yet': as software, like CSound, SuperCollider et al, it has fewer restrictions than most and thus fewer initial assumptions that shape thinking.
Gregory took what I said as an indication that I believed "there’s only one way to do something and that some piece of software does that already". Of course I don’t. There’s always room for development of a concept, and I’m delighted that my provocation produced responses concerning the original elements in the patch under discussion. I suspect no-one would’ve mentioned them if I hadn’t posted… How about greater discussion of those elements and a discourse on further possibilities?
I expect there’ll be lots of posts along the lines of "why can’t I do what I want?" now, perhaps along the lines of DF’s most literate response. If you want to ask that question, you can answer it for yourselves after consideration of this post, or you can come study with me and we’ll spend several years exploring it.
Very relaxing and good mood acoustic scape!
In any case i fiddled with your patch, its cool!
My premise is that i mainly use Max to do music, I cannot even dare to think myself as a Max "programmer" ad hoc, i wish i could!, but i cannot.
So my learning is mainly based on trial and error.
I confess! The new transport system is well, at best addictive.
I find it a great thing.
Plus you can still use all the old syncing tricks which many max users will know better than me (i still remember the pre sync~ MIDI sync "era").
I runned a naive test the other day, 32 metros running at different quant speeds synced to a tranposrt + a phasor which synced sync~ , plus Live in slave. Yes once in a while I had to fiddle with the midioffset of sync~, but to tell you the truth, I couldn
The Universe loops, and dispenses all
kinds of interesting lessons in terms
of generating and organizing variety
from simple materials. Seems as good a
place to start as anywhere.
That was a stirring defense of "quality,"
but I still will cast my pedagogical lot
with the lovely and humble women and men
who taught me and had the grace to be
patient with my thought that I knew better,
believing that I would learn best by seeing
for myself what I did not know. I bless
them (and their memory, in some cases) daily
for being encumbered by doubt and empathy.
> but i thought i’ll better start with something simple than the other
> way round.
That is a perfect strategy…
> still i find it curious that people waste their time insulting other
It is really rare though, it was the first time I got actually angry
when reading that (single) post. Usually I don’t care too much about
trolls which do show up from time to time… ;-)
Keep on going its worth it…
> We live in a culture of easy fixes. Microwave dinners mean you don’t
> have to learn to cook, GarageBand gives everyone a way to make
> music-by-numbers. Reason, Ableton and all the others of that ilk make
> it practical to make music by offering easy routes to the things
> that conventionally are done.
Exactly, but why would you discourage someone who actually is willing to
learn to cook, to not use the easy fix? You said you could do it in Live
why bother with Max… Listen to your own words…
> Ask anyone in Western culture to improvise a rhythm, and it will
> almost always be in 4/4.
I’d never look at the "almost always" but concentrate on those who
don’t. And if someone takes a challenge to get away from the "almost
always" I’d encourage and not discourage them. You can’t possibly expect
that a good (or bad) pop musician turns into a crazy experimentalist
within a day. How long did it take you to get away from classical music
or whatever your personal mainstream background might have been?
> The vast majority were colourless montages of the same sounds and
This seems to be a common problem in the academic world. But still there
are exceptions, and only those count, for these exceptions I also love
the academic world…
> Mark Applebaum, who curated one of the concerts, wrote in his note
> for the programme that he’d had a serious problem choosing enough
> works because: "I found myself yearning for music… which is not
> bland, tedious, lethargic, conventional, or cynical…suggesting the
> most alarming and depressing consequence of a seemingly consolidated
> current common practice’ ".
The problem there is, that the most interesting music doesn’t transport
well in a fixed medium. You have to see a performance… But applying
for a conference or festival is usually done with fixed media
recordings. Those who can polish a recording eventually have a lack in
other skills, and there is music which needs the moment at which it
comes into being live to be understood at all…
> It was also notable that the tone of the conference was very much
> directed toward "how I did this/how we can do this", rather than the
> musical value of what was being done. Technology can – and does –
> mislead those who want to make music. (Some seemed surprised that
> posting on this forum received a comment about musical values:
> perhaps that says a lot.)
That is the nature of the beast. Still the ICMC’s I attended where full
of discussions about music on a personal basis, though not necessarily
in the presentations… ;-)
> Creativity is what this argument is all about. The software is just a
> tool. Thus what needs to be questioned is the *why* of doing what
> one is doing. Joshua asked whether I’d stop students doing something
> that I’d seen "sixteen million" times before: the answer is yes, of
> course I would.
That means most of your students stop immediately being your students?
> And I would spend as long as I could explaining why and offering ways
> to develop alternatives.
There is nothing wrong with that, but there is no need to stop them. I’d
rather ask how to open them for new directions. Its better to start with
what they know and love already, and then show something different. To
stop them seems not a very effective method for me, but you might have
different experiences then I have…
> And this is the root of what appears to be a prejudice against
> ‘looping’. Actually, it’s a rationally-derived decision to be
> suspicious of labels, wherever it’s possible, because the very label
> itself already entraps one’s thinking.
Looping in my view, isn’t a label, as guitar music isn’t a label. Its a
sort of instrument, that’s all…!
> Of course, the old adage that there’s nothing new under the sun is
> mostly true: it is rare that one of us can escape our cultural
> heritage sufficiently to invent something never seen or heard before,
> but *you can try*.
This is rare in general, and it even isn’t a requirement for making good
music. And just trying isn’t enough, if you "just try" you failed
already, that is not a criterion for quality. Best example are the
pieces you didn’t like at the ICMC, I bet they all tried…
As you pointed out before, its not about the tool, its not about using
sequencers, loopers, samplers. All this doesn’t matter. Its about
> It should be clear now why I said Max ‘is to do stuff no-one does
> yet': as software, like CSound, SuperCollider et al! , it has fewer
> restrictions than most and thus fewer initial assumptions that shape
It does make it easier to get rid of initial assumptions, but first you
have to be aware of them. Or you fall into the same trap, Actually for
you Max is for doing stuff no-one does, for others its just a tool…;-)
> Gregory took what I said as an indication that I believed "there’s
> only one way to do something and that some piece of software does
> that already". Of course I don’t. There’s always room for development
> of a concept, and I’m delighted that my provocation produced
> responses concerning the original elements in the patch under
It seem your initial assumption about that patch was that this is the
complete musical concept. But how could you tell if you didn’t hear a
single sound of music made with it?
It is as if you’d reject a cello because its an already known musical
Not that I would expect a masterpiece which could be done with a patch
like that in its initial state, but we all started somewhere and had to
do the first steps, you probably know it from your own experience…
> I suspect no-one would’ve mentioned them if I hadn’t posted… How
> about greater discussion of those elements and a discourse on further
Yes, please in a new thread, and no insults to innocent newcomers are
necessary to provoke, better provoke with your music…
To throw in some real music, go to http://www.carnyxscotland.co.uk/ to
listen to some improvisations I did with John Kenny recently in the
church of La Tourette (he also played in Belfast this year, so you might
have a memory of the real thing…).
I place my instrument, "Les Ondes Memorielles:, into the looping
Negative as positive comments are welcome, I am not in the beginning of
my explorations… ;-)
I am curious what you’ll come up with…
I’d love to see more links to real music…
Is there a direct link to the recordings? I could only find links to
CDs on the site.
On 10 Oct 2008, at 09:21, Stefan Tiedje wrote:
> To throw in some real music, go to http://www.carnyxscotland.co.uk/
> to listen to some improvisations I did with John Kenny recently
David Stevens schrieb:
> hi Stefan,
> Is there a direct link to the recordings? I could only find links to CDs
> on the site.
Its further down, a link called listen to WindSlaps…
Forums > MaxMSP