Forums > MaxMSP

Re: new apple bullshit books

Jan 12 2006 | 11:22 pm

Jan 13 2006 | 2:38 am

I guess that really lies in the eye of the beholder.

They wont be available for a month, and I think there will likely be some
nice apps by then.

You dont need Logic to do "serious audio work"

Jan 13 2006 | 2:56 am

On Jan 12, 2006, at 6:22 PM, Roman Thilenius wrote:

> here is some more love:
> – intel macs wont run classic enviroment or classic compatible apps.

OS X came out four years ago. You knew four years ago that such
support would eventually end. If you’re still depending on such
applications, you’re in a very small minority.

> – intel macs will not support booting into windows before 2007
> (i.e. next generation of windows)

This is not necessarily true… It is possible to emulate BIOS with
the new system. Furthermore, why reboot into windows when you can run
it at full speed side by side anyway via Virtual PC, Xen, VMware, etc?

> – intel mac are currently not supported by any of the linux
> distributions.

This is true. They came out two days ago. … ? I expect this to be
remedied inside a month, as this hardware is very attractive to a lot
of people.

> – release dates for logic pro: 3 months+, photoshop: 4-5 months+

Come on, this is the 90’s. Stop sequencing, start coding. As for
Photoshop, there are plenty of free alternatives. Even then, it still
runs passably in emulation as Mr. Jobs showed.

> – you can completely forget any serious audio work for at least 6
> months.

If you depend on Max, perhaps (I have no idea when an update will
arrive). Not everyone does though. Depending on how well alsa gets
along with the new system, it may only be a matter of weeks.

> – the intel duo core C++ dev kit is a beta version.

C++? No loss there. (Haha, only serious…)

> – the firmware of intel duocore chips is generally prepeared
> to support DRM and "trusted computing" for the safety of all of us.

And of course it does nothing without OS support. If Apple wants to
do it, they’re going to do it regardless of the hardware. If they
don’t want to, then again the hardware doesn’t matter.

> – they are as fast as dell PCs – which can boot into OS X,
> windows, and linux – but still cost as much as the last G4 ibook did.

Dell PCs can boot into OS X? Really? Bring one over, let’s install
10.4.4 on it.
As for the price, it is a good deal. Dual core, x1600, 15", DVD-RW,
camera, firewire, fancy power connector, OS X, iLife, attractive
case, third party Mac apps (adium, camino, quicksilver, whatever
else)… A comparable Dell is going to cost with a few hundred
dollars, and might even cost more.

I don’t know why I bother with these emails… killing time until
Aqua Teen actually…

– John

Jan 13 2006 | 8:54 am

Depends on what you do. Going this way, you don’t need any computer, you
can just clap your hands.

Jan 13 2006 | 1:14 pm

to add to that :

On 13-jan-2006, at 0:22, Roman Thilenius wrote:

> whats all those messages about the macdonalds books about?

Jan 13 2006 | 3:39 pm

I want my Powerbook 100 back – of course with a G5 processor upgrade
and capable of running OS 7 – 9, and OS X and Linux as well as
Windows 1.0 and Vista, when it comes out.

Guys, stop the whining, please.


Jan 13 2006 | 5:23 pm

Quite to the contrary: It’s very easy to complain.

…and keep up the kazoo, it doesn’t require any power. ;-))


Jan 13 2006 | 6:00 pm

>Guys, stop the whining, please.

I’m generally with Georg on this, but I am reminded of my last bad
day with computers, earlier this Winter during a rehearsal, when I
pledged to shift to playing the kazoo (pianos have too many moving
parts). Everything’s relative, you know and frankly, I find it very
difficult to complain regardless of any particular month’s glitch,
compatibility issue or whatever.

Bob Gluck

Robert J. Gluck

Assistant Professor of Music
Director, Electronic Music Studios
Affiliate faculty, Department of Judaic Studies
Affiliate faculty, College of Information Sciences

University at Albany
PAC 312
1400 Washington Avenue
Albany, NY 12222

"Some I know, the cawing crow and three pulsed dove that sounds a coo
nothing like a baby’s. Others I cannot name: trill-like-insect
sibilant-song and a gullet-throbbing call forced out by the staccato
notes that follow. It all comes together like a symphony. the passing
cars, notes with flags. counterpoint to the birds." (Susan
Robertson, ‘Morning Prayers’)

Jan 13 2006 | 6:20 pm

Unless you have an electric kazoo! I know I do :-)

(though technically it doesn’t *need* power unless you want to amplify it)


Jan 13 2006 | 9:12 pm

soilworks could kick apples ass.

Jan 13 2006 | 9:14 pm

zsolt hearts steve jobs.

Jan 13 2006 | 9:48 pm

you mean SolidWorks ? ;-D

Jan 13 2006 | 9:53 pm

chhhhut ! he could come back from reaktor’s list…

Jan 13 2006 | 10:38 pm

On Jan 13, 2006, at 8:14 AM, Gideon Kiers wrote:

> to add to that :

Oh heavens. I’m not Mac-nut, but…

Power: The fact that the power supply is not 85W instead of 65W does
not mean more heat. It is not as if they draw 85W constantly — Only
when needed. It is entirely possible that the 85W model was just in
greater supply at the time, or that it is more efficient.

Parts missing: S-Video (so? S-Video is crap), modem (so!? it is an
add-on option), PCMCIA (if you need it, keep your laptop for awhile,
and if not, you’ll be glad you have ExpressPort in a year or two),
Firewire 800 (yes, this legitimately sucks).

Visually unimpressive: Slightly lower resolution, yes, but supposedly
a lot brighter and most likely faster responding. I’ll take it. Stick
the dock on the right side. I have a 15" now with 1280×854 and I
wouldn’t want things much smaller anyway.

Burning issues: Yes, sucks. Not sure why this is the case.

Arbitrary additions: Yes, anything "you" don’t need is automatically
bloat/unnecessary. I’d personally love a built in camera. I could
strip and make money via the internet.

Performance: Not buying the skipping on H.264 argument. My Powerbook
1.25GHz with 1Gb of RAM skips to hell on the HD version of the
trailer he mentioned (I assumed he’s talking full 1080p). I get about
6fps. I don’t see how he is getting any more than 10 with his laptop.
Furthermore, the Core Duo supports SSE2, and is much faster than the
G4, and there are two cores, so if Quicktime *is* slower than it is
an issue with Quicktime, not the hardware.

EFI: You’ll likely be able to run Windows side by side anyway.
Microsoft will make sure of this with Virtual PC. (You can also run a
bunch of other OSS solutions now as well.) No reason to boot into it.
No reason to fault Apple for using the latest technology which
Windows doesn’t support — That’s their problem.

Shapeshifter/APE sucks.

– John

Jan 13 2006 | 11:11 pm

The pleasures of hypocrisy. You don’t need S video, yet many of us do,
whether or not it is "crap". It’s not just that I’d "love" one, but as a
performing artist, I need one. And unless I want to pay for a
scan-converter, I need S video for recording my studio pieces.

> —–Original Message—–
> From: John Nowak []
> Sent: Friday, January 13, 2006 5:39 PM
> To:
> Subject: Re: [max-msp] [OT] new apple bullshit books.

When John doesn’t want something someone else wants:

> Parts missing: S-Video (so? S-Video is crap),

When John wants something someone else doesn’t:

> Yes, anything "you" don’t need is automatically
> bloat/unnecessary. I’d personally love a built in camera.

Jan 13 2006 | 11:25 pm

On Jan 13, 2006, at 2:38 PM, John Nowak wrote:

> I’d personally love a built in camera. I could strip and make money
> via the internet.

John, *please* let let us know when/where we can log in to see
this!!! I think the frenzy of MacBook anticipation has us all worked
up, and we could really use a release :)


Jan 13 2006 | 11:38 pm

DVI->Svideo adaptor $19 from


v a d e //

Jan 13 2006 | 11:42 pm

Jan 13 2006 | 11:50 pm

Anyone remember when the G3 iMac first came out? The uproar? "The
604e is a much better CPU", cries of "where’s my SCSI", "where’s my
floppy drive", "how will I plug in my serial MIDI adapter", "can’t
boot into System 7.x", etc, blah, blah.

I think we’ll all be fine. If I really wanted to complain about
spending extra $$$ on hardware, I’d bring up the fact that my lovely
G4 Powerbook won’t last forever, and I’ll have to replace it one day
period. I’d much rather spend $0 and have it last forever, thanks :)

arliss renwick l

Jan 14 2006 | 12:26 am

On Jan 13, 2006, at 6:11 PM, Adam Kendall wrote:

> The pleasures of hypocrisy. You don’t need S video, yet many of us
> do,
> whether or not it is "crap". It’s not just that I’d "love" one,
> but as a
> performing artist, I need one. And unless I want to pay for a
> scan-converter, I need S video for recording my studio pieces.

You can just use a DVI adapter, no?

– John

Jan 14 2006 | 1:59 am

Jan 14 2006 | 9:13 am

Is that so, wirklich?


Jan 14 2006 | 10:52 am

Subject header says it all.

Discussion of what, exactly, Apple’s new hardware does and does not
contain are helpful. People need to be aware of what the new machines
will and, more importantly, will not do/support/include-in-the-box.

Cries of "bullshit" and responses "no, you’re full of bullshit" ("no,
you are!" "yer mudda wears army boots!") are not helpful.

Thank you for your consideration.

————– ————–
Peter Castine | ^
| Litter Power & Litter Bundle for Jitter | | iCE: Sequencing, Recording, and Interface Building | for Max/MSP
| Extremely cool

Jan 14 2006 | 12:57 pm

Where is the 17 inch version ? does anybody know what their plans are ?

Jan 15 2006 | 5:28 pm

Jan 16 2006 | 3:11 pm

Bowcott, Peter wrote:
> Where is the 17 inch version ? does anybody know what their plans are ?

I’ve stolen them, to prevent anybody to have a new 17" MacBook Pro
before I could afford one. I try to convince Apple to invest into an
Atari emulator to run some old programs but seemlessly integrated into
OS X. On the other hand I might trade the plans for an uncrippled
Windows Vista running Solaris in VMWare…

I made my switch from OS 9 to OS X maybe 2 or 3 years after OS X was
available and it was good to do so. I do not see any need to hurry in
this case either…


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Stefan Tiedje
Electronic Composition

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Jan 16 2006 | 9:47 pm

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