Floating Point

This is a simple patch to illustrate a simple concept. But is there an even simpler way to do it (ie like just using one object that's already designed to do input quantizing?)

real-time-quantize

i'd be interested to look at it, but i am on 4. could you tell a bit more about what you are trying to do? or include the file as a .maxpat attachment so i can convert it.

It'd be easier not to have to measure the times/delays for each event and just collect events since the last tick and dump them out on the next tick.

Here's the attached version. I'm sorry about the patch being incompatible with max 4. In my opinion this incompatibility sucks big time as it basically splits the max community in half- the 'have-fives' and the 'have-not-fives'. I believe it is basically a very juvenile decision on the part of 'cycling 74'. Its like some local government putting a freeway in the middle of a suburb and thereby ruining it by dividing it. I could keep up the metaphors, but I'm sure you could think of a few others yourselves. c74 have vandalized (inadvertently?intentionally?)their own community.

Yeah, thanks, that's simpler, and more importantly a different approach. I appreciate your looking at it and responding.

Yeah, thanks, that's simpler, and more importantly a different approach. I appreciate your looking at it and responding.
tm


Quote: Terry McDermott wrote on Mon, 04 August 2008 16:00

----------------------------------------------------

> Here's the attached version. I'm sorry about the patch being incompatible with max 4. In my opinion this incompatibility sucks big time as it basically splits the max community in half- the 'have-fives' and the 'have-not-fives'. 

Well, given that it's basically impossible to do a complete job of the Max 5 -> Max 4 conversion, it's easy for me to see why Cycling didn't want to invest time in it.

I would rather they spend their time on the SDK, Pluggo, and Jitter 2 than on an imperfect 5->4 converter.

Quote: Terry McDermott wrote on Mon, 04 August 2008 16:00
----------------------------------------------------
> Here's the attached version. I'm sorry about the patch being incompatible with max 4. In my opinion this incompatibility sucks big time as it basically splits the max community in half- the 'have-fives' and the 'have-not-fives'. 
----------------------------------------------------

I would rather they spend their time on the SDK, Pluggo, and Jitter 2 than on an imperfect 5->4 converter.


I agree with Chris Muir on the conversion-thing, and I like how he puts it, too(looking forward and all).

But just in case you didn't know about this supercollider Max5-Max4 converter(it works for some things, not everything...), you could check it out here:

> download supercollider 3.2 or newer from 

> see readme for installation instructions and info on how the

by fredrik oloffsson:
> written in supercollider... ;-)
>
> max5 .maxpat to max4 .pat converter
>
> download MaxPat.zip from http://www.fredrikolofsson.com/pages/
> code-sc.html
> download supercollider 3.2 or newer from http://
> supercollider.sourceforge.net
> see readme for installation instructions and info on how the
> conversion works


The patch I posted on this thread and a million others like it would easily be convertible as it contains objects from the common object set of v4/v5. Obviously there are limitations to a conversion from 'format-5.x' back to 'format-4.x'. That's not my point; neither is speculation how much time they would or would not spend on other parts of the software development. My point is it has evidently been intentionally designed that way, to have built-in incompatibility (or more accurately, 'built-out' potential compatibility). It is that and only that that sucks.

Quote: Chris Muir wrote on Tue, 05 August 2008 09:17

> Well, given that it's basically impossible to do a complete job of the Max 5 -> Max 4 conversion, it's easy for me to see why Cycling didn't want to invest time in it.

> I would rather they spend their time on the SDK, Pluggo, and Jitter 2 than on an imperfect 5->4 converter.

> Well, given that it's basically impossible to do a complete job of the Max 5 -> Max 4 conversion, it's easy for me to see why Cycling didn't want to invest time in it.
>
> I would rather they spend their time on the SDK, Pluggo, and Jitter 2 than on an imperfect 5->4 converter.
>
>
----------------------------------------------------


Thanks for the tip-- I do know about the sc converter, and its great that fredrik ahs done this, but it is not the point. The point is people should not have to resort to roundabout ways to circumvent easily fixable limitations in the software. The fact that a third party has found a way of converting files shows just how easily c74 could do it and it also illustrates some kind of corporate laziness and maybe even a disregard for the community it has built up over the years. Sorry, but it's also got nothing to do with looking forwards, backwards sideways or any other way.

Quote: RabidRaja wrote on Tue, 05 August 2008 09:43

> I agree with Chris Muir on the conversion-thing, and I like how he puts it, too(looking forward and all).

> But just in case you didn't know about this supercollider Max5-Max4 converter(it works for some things, not everything...), you could check it out here:

> > download supercollider 3.2 or newer from 

> > see readme for installation instructions and info on how the

Thanks for the tip-- I do know about the sc converter, and its great that  fredrik ahs done this, but it is not the point. The point is people should not have to resort to roundabout ways to circumvent easily fixable limitations in the software. The fact that a third party has found a way of converting files shows just how easily c74 could do it and it also illustrates some kind of corporate laziness and maybe even a disregard for the community it has built up over the years. Sorry, but it's also got nothing to do with looking forwards, backwards sideways or any other way.

Quote: RabidRaja wrote on Tue, 05 August 2008 09:43
----------------------------------------------------
> I agree with Chris Muir on the conversion-thing, and I like how he puts it, too(looking forward and all).
>
> But just in case you didn't know about this supercollider Max5-Max4 converter(it works for some things, not everything...), you could check it out here:
>
> by fredrik oloffsson:
> > written in supercollider... ;-)
> >
> > max5 .maxpat to max4 .pat converter
> >
> > download MaxPat.zip from http://www.fredrikolofsson.com/pages/
> > code-sc.html
> > download supercollider 3.2 or newer from http://
> > supercollider.sourceforge.net
> > see readme for installation instructions and info on how the
> > conversion works
----------------------------------------------------


To each his own, i still prefer Cycling'74 to focus on the more important issues of newer functionalities.

(the lightbulb by your name says you haven't gone yet, so i figured i'd reply)

On Aug 4, 2008, at 5:00 PM, Terry McDermott wrote:

> Thanks for the tip-- I do know about the sc converter, and its great 

> that fredrik ahs done this, but it is not the point. The point is 

> people should not have to resort to roundabout ways to circumvent 

> easily fixable limitations in the software. The fact that a third 

> party has found a way of converting files shows just how easily c74 

> could do it and it also illustrates some kind of corporate laziness 

> and maybe even a disregard for the community it has built up over 

> the years. Sorry, but it's also got nothing to do with looking 

> forwards, backwards sideways or any other way.

If it was Max5 had a convertor that did a less than 100% job, people 

would scream. If a third-party developer comes up with an 80% solution 

that's a good thing. It has to do with people's expectations. Trying 

to do a comprehensive job at this conversion is a nigh-on 

I don't think that Cycling created a new file format with the intent 

of balkanizing the community, that's just an unfortunate side effect 

of the progress that was made in the Max 5 implementation.

On Aug 4, 2008, at 5:00 PM, Terry McDermott wrote:
> Thanks for the tip-- I do know about the sc converter, and its great  
> that  fredrik ahs done this, but it is not the point. The point is  
> people should not have to resort to roundabout ways to circumvent  
> easily fixable limitations in the software. The fact that a third  
> party has found a way of converting files shows just how easily c74  
> could do it and it also illustrates some kind of corporate laziness  
> and maybe even a disregard for the community it has built up over  
> the years. Sorry, but it's also got nothing to do with looking  
> forwards, backwards sideways or any other way.

If it was Max5 had a convertor that did a less than 100% job, people  
would scream. If a third-party developer comes up with an 80% solution  
that's a good thing. It has to do with people's expectations. Trying  
to do a comprehensive job at this conversion is a nigh-on  
insurmountable problem.

I don't think that Cycling created a new file format with the intent  
of balkanizing the community, that's just an unfortunate side effect  
of the progress that was made in the Max 5 implementation.

Chris Muir
cbm@well.com	
http://www.xfade.com

Quote: Chris Muir wrote on Tue, 05 August 2008 01:17

> Quote: Terry McDermott wrote on Mon, 04 August 2008 16:00

> ----------------------------------------------------

> > it basically splits the max community in half- the 'have-fives' and the 'have-not-fives'. 

Very true. This "great divide" is a non-issue. 

Quote: Chris Muir wrote on Tue, 05 August 2008 01:17
----------------------------------------------------
> Quote: Terry McDermott wrote on Mon, 04 August 2008 16:00
> ----------------------------------------------------
> > it basically splits the max community in half- the 'have-fives' and the 'have-not-fives'. 
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> I would rather they spend their time on the SDK, Pluggo, and Jitter 2 than on an imperfect 5->4 converter.
>
>

Very true. This "great divide" is a non-issue. 


yay for pluggo, sdk, and other newish, useful things.

fredrik has done a great thing in making the patch converter for those who want it. we all do have finite resources and must make choices. and as for 'to each his own', whenever i read suggestions that max is incomplete without a standard au~ object, it puts me in a very cold, dark place.

fredrik has done a great thing in making the patch converter for those who want it.  we all do have finite resources and must make choices.  and as for 'to each his own', whenever i read suggestions that max is incomplete without a standard au~ object, it puts me in a very cold, dark place.

Max 5's system of time management has quantization built in

Ah, interesting. So to do the equivalent(ish) of my coll patch you could do:

> My point is it has evidently been intentionally designed that way, to

> have built-in incompatibility (or more accurately, 'built-out'

> potential compatibility). It is that and only that that sucks.

If you look at a patch as text in Max 4 and in Max 5, it is evident, 

that a lot of the problems which had been caused by a not readable 

format are solved by changing the format. If the old format had been 

good in any regard they would have kept it. It was the best point to 

ditch it, as the whole application had been rewritten...

C74 expressed several times, that they are happy if anybody creates a 

That had been done, and if its not good enough for you, I suggest to 

include into your version an unpacker for the compressed format...

Terry McDermott schrieb:
> My point is it has evidently been intentionally designed that way, to
> have built-in incompatibility (or more accurately, 'built-out'
> potential compatibility). It is that and only that that sucks.

If you look at a patch as text in Max 4 and in Max 5, it is evident, 
that a lot of the problems which had been caused by a not readable 
format are solved by changing the format. If the old format had been 
good in any regard they would have kept it. It was the best point to 
ditch it, as the whole application had been rewritten...
C74 expressed several times, that they are happy if anybody creates a 
converter.
That had been done, and if its not good enough for you, I suggest to 
include into your version an unpacker for the compressed format...

-- 
Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
--_____-----------|--------------
--(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
-- _|_)----|-----()--------------
----------()--------www.ccmix.com


This time management has been a bit of a double-edged sword for my work:

On one hand it's a remarkable update and really interesting to work with 

(great example, too, Andrew - pipe is my new favourite object!!!! )

On the other I really feel the documentation is lacking in this area - I 

see little snippets being inserted into the help files, and I've seen 

the Time Management page in the reference, but... I don't know, somehow 

it irks me to have to get the goodies on the max list like this. Then 

there are some objects that respond to it, some which do it in a limited 

Are there specific parts of the new lessons we all need to do?

> Max 5's system of time management has quantization built in

This time management has been a bit of a double-edged sword for my work:
On one hand it's a remarkable update and really interesting to work with 
(great example, too, Andrew - pipe is my new favourite object!!!! )

On the other I really feel the documentation is lacking in this area - I 
see little snippets being inserted into the help files, and I've seen 
the Time Management page in the reference, but... I don't know, somehow 
it irks me to have to get the goodies on the max list like this. Then 
there are some objects that respond to it, some which do it in a limited 
fashion and so on.

Andreas
-- 
> Max 5's system of time management has quantization built in
>
> ----------begin_max5_patcher----------


I recommend a thorough scouring of Manuel's awesome ITM modular synth, boogie box, you name it example

Cycling '74Max 5.0examplessequencing-loopingCyclistMusic

From there, all the objects have ref pages. If you get stuck, yell out.

Thanks for your response(s); will study Max's time management features (I never read manuals, no, not really).

Thanks for your response(s); will study Max's time management features (I never read manuals, no, not really).
tm


Max5/examples/interface/live-quantize.maxpat

How would one go about building a system with different quantization settings for the on and off states?

I've been trying figure this out but I'm not very familiar with the new timing schemes of version

How would one go about building a system with different quantization settings for the on and off states? 

I've been trying figure this out but I'm not very familiar with the new timing schemes of version 

real time quantize