ambisonics for non-standar speaker setup
hello people...
i would like to manipulate sound in space, into a non-standar circular speaker set up like quad or 5.1. I try to build an installation with a 3d speaker grid, and my mazor problem is how to treat panning and trajectories in different speaker setups..
In any circular surround setup there are standar formulas for panning and general diffusion...What about when u have to manipulate sound in 3d speaker arrays and weird shapes and setups?
Is the solution to learn ambisonics?
I tried isct ambisonics for maxmsp ,read some theory, but its very difficult for me to understand if ambisonics is the solution for me...(and by the way, do i have to buy any commercial decoder to work with ambisonics and my computer?)
The attached photo shows an ypothetical trajectory within the array
of speakers..
Hello,
Ambisonics is a good solution as it works for any number of speakers at arbitrary places. Besides the great ICST work, you can try the CICM ambisonic (and Spatialisation) objects:
http://cicm.mshparisnord.org/ (click on "[Downloads]" in the left column)
You can also make a custom simple spatialization based on level changes (for example). When looking at your picture, it looks possible to do such trajectory with something similar to usual stereo amplitude panning, but across several speakers. If you want to move bigger sound masses (not points along lines), each mass involving a sub-array of speakers, it might become more complex, though it's still possible to do it in a similar way.
You said about something similar to usual stereo amplitude panning, across several speakers...
This was my first thought, because to deal with ambisonics its a bit hard for me...
The thing i dont know is, if the formula for usual stereo panning works across different planes and angles..What happens with constant power curve and images? The listener in my installation is not static in one circle of speakers, so what are the laws of spatialization then? Thats why i thought ambisonics...But if there is a way to do it simply with level changes, i would be happy..
Thanx people for the links and your help...
And yet another set of ambisonic objects(!):
On Oct 29, 2007, at 2:04 PM, julienbreval wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> Ambisonics is a good solution as it works for any number of
> speakers at arbitrary places. Besides the great ICST work, you can
> try the CICM ambisonic (and Spatialisation) objects:
>
> http://cicm.mshparisnord.org/ (click on "[Downloads]" in the left
> column)
>
>
> You can also make a custom simple spatialization based on level
> changes (for example). When looking at your picture, it looks
> possible to do such trajectory with something similar to usual
> stereo amplitude panning, but across several speakers. If you want
> to move bigger sound masses (not points along lines), each mass
> involving a sub-array of speakers, it might become more complex,
> though it's still possible to do it in a similar way.
>
grrr waaa
www.grahamwakefield.net
unfortunately dbap is for mac, i have pc...
anyway, can anyone tell me if simple stereo panning works in 3d arrays of speakers?
Is it nessecery to work with ambisonics?
check out vbap (vector based amplitude panning), it's a calulator for
pairwise panning in 2D or triplewise panning 3D.
it does implement a spread factor, so a source can extend over more
than just the immediate neighbouring speakers.
http://www.maxobjects.com/?
v=objects&id_objet=1197&requested=vbap&operateur=AND&id_plateforme=0
http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/software/vbap/MAX_MSP/
> unfortunately dbap is for mac, i have pc...
vbap is fully crossplatform. it uses the now "standard distro"
matrix~ object for DSP processing.
> anyway, can anyone tell me if simple stereo panning works in 3d
> arrays of speakers?
hmm, no. since you have to take into account more than 2 speakers.
vbap implements triangles, which is the minimum neighbourhood for a
source in a sphere.
> Is it nessecery to work with ambisonics?
not at all. vbap is a very viable light-weight solution and gives
very good pinpoint localisation if you have enough speakers.
ambisonics is a more complex beast which works on the principle of
generating a full spherical soundfield on all speakers at the same time.
for some theory on ambisonics go to:
hth
/*j
