This is an "audio" program right?
Im through the first 13 tutorials of MAXtutorial and out of curiosity i looked through to see if there was a tutorial on how to get sound to come out of this program, and lo and behold, no there isnt. Max reads my midi piano fine, but it wont play any sounds, not with audio out, not with notein > noteout, not with midiin > midiout or any combination thereof, on any DSP setting. Is there some magic button i am unaware of that makes this program produce sound?
On a similar note, at what point in the tutorials am i expected to start hearing something?
look at the MSP~ tutorials.
MSP is something like "Max signal processing"
Max is not an 'audio' program - this is a programming environment
that coincidentally makes producing video and audio easy.
Max is logic and midi, msp is signal processing (which can be used to
generate noise), Jitter is matrix processing (hat can be used to
generate 2D and 3D images) -
*****but its all just numbers******
On Dec 18, 2006, at 10:50 PM, Ettin wrote:
>
> Im through the first 13 tutorials of MAXtutorial and out of
> curiosity i looked through to see if there was a tutorial on how to
> get sound to come out of this program, and lo and behold, no there
> isnt. Max reads my midi piano fine, but it wont play any sounds,
> not with audio out, not with notein > noteout, not with midiin >
> midiout or any combination thereof, on any DSP setting. Is there
> some magic button i am unaware of that makes this program produce
> sound?
>
> On a similar note, at what point in the tutorials am i expected to
> start hearing something?
v a d e //
www.vade.info
abstrakt.vade.info
> Is there some magic button i am unaware of that makes this program produce
> sound?
mute/unmute in your system mixer maybe?
If all you want to do is get sound, then you can simply select your built-in midi device, as opposed to sending your audio to an external device, e.g. in Windows, you might choose 'Microsoft Synthesizer' in the midi setup menu.
MSP will allow you to do the sorts of things you'd normally have to throw your external synth into Edit mode to do...but a lot more of course, since it allows you to actually create the functions you plan to tweak.
Could anyone direct me to a patch that shows the most fundemental setup for getting sound to come from my midi piano, through max, to my speakers?
On 20 Dec 2006, at 6:04, Ettin wrote:
>
> Could anyone direct me to a patch that shows the most fundemental
> setup for getting sound to come from my midi piano, through max, to
> my speakers?
Hi,
You should immediately go to you kitchen, and check if espresso machine is
on. I've heard rumors max won't produce any sound if you are cooking long
espresso nearby. Short ones should work.
hth,
nesa
Quote: usdryad@hotmail.com wrote on Wed, 20 December 2006 07:04
----------------------------------------------------
> Could anyone direct me to a patch that shows the most fundemental setup for getting sound to come from my midi piano, through max, to my speakers?
----------------------------------------------------
paste this into a new patcher window:
btw don't forget to connect a midi cable from your computer's midi output to your midi piano and to connect an audio cable from you midi piano to your amplifier.
Look at this code as the way to program
- a link with the midi device driver of your system
- an open and initialized midi port
- a conversion between velocity and note values to a 3-byte midi message
- a user interface that provides feedback on your actions
- a threading mechanism to manage events generated by your user interface
- etc
- etc
As vade stated, max is not an audio program but a programming environment. It makes programming audio applications so easy that a lot of people confuse it with an audio program.
Cheers,
Mattijs
Ettin wrote:
> Could anyone direct me to a patch that shows the most fundemental
> setup for getting sound to come from my midi piano, through max, to
> my speakers?
You need to connect physically your audio out of the midi piano to the
audio in of your sound card. Then activate with one of the switches audio:
If you expect the internal Midi sound device to route audio to Max, its
more complicated. Because the internal Midi program doesn't know
anything about Max and can't do anything but sending its audio to your
computers standard outputs.
Software solutions depend on the operating system and hardware...
Usually the internal GM sound synths are so bad that nobody bothers too
much to use them. (Only Midi programs use them, I don't know of any
"audio" programs which use them (as audio))
Stefan
--
Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
--_____-----------|--------------
--(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
-- _|_)----|-----()--------------
----------()--------www.ccmix.com
Quote: usdryad@hotmail.com wrote on Tue, 19 December 2006 23:04
----------------------------------------------------
> Could anyone direct me to a patch that shows the most fundemental setup for getting sound to come from my midi piano, through max, to my speakers?
----------------------------------------------------
eventually the objects [dac~] and [adc~] will do this
for you.
if you need help about how to move your mouse cursor
or how to make coffee call me offline.
-110
stephan and mattijs, your patches dont work, under any dsp or midi setting.
I can play my midi piano fine through cubase, it will always make sound, so my setup and connections are fine. Why is it no one here knows how to make a midi piano play through max out to the speakers?
Hi Ettin,
The very wording of your question (and this followup response) is
somewhat vague. Do you want MaxMSP to control the MIDI piano via
MIDI; or do you want the audio from the MIDI piano to somehow be
processed through MaxMSP; or both of these? It is unclear exactly
what you are after. Perhaps rewording your request in less ambiguous
fashion would be helpful.
For now, however, perhaps the key is that you don't yet have a good
grasp of MaxMSP? In addition to just 'loading and running the
patches' there are a number of configuration details you need to
specify before MaxMSP will send/receive audio and/or MIDI. Did you
properly configure the MIDI settings within MaxMSP? Did you properly
configure the connection to whatever audio interface & driver you are
using? These are all covered in the MaxMSP documentation. As well, if
you want to process the audio from your piano, is the audio output
from the piano routed into the computer, then the computer audio
routed back out to your speakers? There are a number of variables
here...since (presumably) no one on the list has seen your setup,
it's hard to magically provide solutions. It's more a matter of
providing some ideas for possible solutions for you to explore on
your own.
In any case, I'd suggest a more cooperative attitude...especially
when asking for help. It makes folks more inclined to share their
knowledge & experience. Just my $0.02 worth...
Best of luck,
Steven
On Dec 21, 2006, at 3:39 PM, Ettin wrote:
>
> stephan and mattijs, your patches dont work, under any dsp or midi
> setting.
>
> I can play my midi piano fine through cubase, it will always make
> sound, so my setup and connections are fine. Why is it no one here
> knows how to make a midi piano play through max out to the speakers?
----
Steven M. Miller
Associate Professor of Contemporary Music
College of Santa Fe
Contemporary Music Program
1600 St. Michaels Drive
Santa Fe NM 87505
http://pubweb.csf.edu/~smill
(505) 473-6197
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SFIFEM
Atrium Sound Space
OVOS
*opportunities for composers & sound artists*
why should you expect to get something straight away? who told you that would happen?
The hour's approaching to give it your best / And you've got to reach your prime / That's when you need to put yourself to the test / And show us the passage of time / We're gonna need a montage / Ooh, it takes a montage / Show a lot of things happening at once / Remind everyone of what's going on / In every shot, show a little improvement / To show it all would take too long / That's called a montage / Girl, we want a montage / In anything, if you want to go / From just a beginner to a pro / You need a montage / Even Rocky had a montage / Always fade out in a montage / If you fade out it seems like more time has passed in a montage..
not my words, but the words of top gear magazine
I'm going to go out on a limb here and try to answer your question as directly and concretely as I can. Remember that most folks here are willing to help beginners, but not real supportive of rewriting the Max documentation on the forums for those who don't read it on their own. But this is relatively simple and straightforward, so here we go. (On down, I cite the pages in the documentation that covers all of this).
If I can infer some details from your sketchy comments--when you are using Cubase, the MIDI data from your physical MIDI keyboard is (automatically?) either routed to some software synthesizer that is either part of Cubase or your OS, or to a piece of hardware--either your sound card or an external synth that is receiving MIDI from your computer. You should know what that synth is, how to access it in Cubase, how to choose patches on it, how to change the routing to a different synth, etc. If you have that information in hand, then you are well on your way. In any case, some kind of synthesizer that lives on or in the software of your computer or in an external piece of hardware connected via MIDI is actually producing the audio data that has its last conversion in your brain as sound. You are triggering the synth with your keyboard, with Cubase handling the routing.
With Max, you will do all the routing right there in the patcher window where you do everything else. Unless you are using a softsynth VST plugin, you should not need to use any MSP objects to accomplish what you are asking, because Max will only be dealing with MIDI data, not audio data.
Let's say your keyboard is a "Kawasaki 1200-76," and you're using a SoundFont/DLS bank for your sounds (what your web browser might use when it comes across a MIDI file embedded in a page), say "crazy_banks.dls". Your patcher would have notein, midiin, ctlin, bendin, etc. MIDI input objects at the top to receive the MIDI input. When the patcher is locked, you can double-click on those objects to choose which midi device it should listen to for data (in your case, Kawasaki 1200-76). (In edit mode, command-dblclick or ctrl-dblclick.) The simplest thing is notein connected to noteout. Do the same double click thing on the noteout, and choose the crazy_banks.dls from the list. If instead you want the MIDI output to go back out through your MIDI interface to another hardware synth (or even the Kawasaki 1200), then choose the appropriate port from the popup menu on the output object.
All this will work beautifully if you have no problems in your setup. All the setup stuff is covered thoroughly in Max46Fundamentals, p. 8 and pp. 23-37. Especially look at p. 28 (using the MIDI setup window), 29 (default devices for midi objects, and using the DLS synthesizer), and 31-32 (virtual input and output).
If you've done the first 13 Max tutorials, then you have done number 12 which covers the patching aspect of all of this. Again, all the gory setup details are given full treatment in the Fundamentals document, including creating your own virtual ports and the like.
Max automatically sets up two handy-dandy virtual in and out ports for inter-application MIDI connections. You should be able to route your noteout object to "from MaxMSP 1" (the first vitual port), and set your software synth to receive on this same port. If after all this you are still having trouble, check to see that Max's notein is listening on the channel that your keyboard is sending on, and that the synth at the end of the MIDI chain is likewise on the right channel, or listening to all channels.
If you still are having trouble, first check the volume of your computer, your speakers, check the fuses in your amplifier, or have your doctor check clean out your ears (don't dare try to clean it out yourself).
If you opened Tutorial 12 and didn't hear some default software synth, then I understand a little frustration on your part. Go back over you MIDI setup with the Fundamentals document, and all should be well. Go back to tutorial 12, double click on all those input and output objects to choose the appropriate ports, and it should work.
It's worth noting that you should have some fun using Max/MSP in conjunction with Cubase because of all the interapplication routing that it supports. You can use the virtual MIDI ports, create your own, use Soundflower to route audio channels between them, or use MSP's rewire~ object to use Rewire technology.
Ettin wrote:
> stephan and mattijs, your patches dont work, under any dsp or midi
> setting.
For sure they work here... (I can play my sounds fine through Max/MSP)
> I can play my midi piano fine through cubase, it will always make
> sound, so my setup and connections are fine. Why is it no one here
> knows how to make a midi piano play through max out to the speakers?
We still have no idea what you are dealing with. There are a trillion
"midi piano"s out there some are hardware (these boxes with black and
white keys you have to put your fingers on and which don't need a
computer) some are part of your operating system very different between
Apple OS X and Windoof. Some are plug-ins which is also software, some
are standalone programs. The only info so far we have is, that you run
Cubase where everything seems fine. (But there must be a reason why you
want to look into Max... ;-)
Please
Which Midi piano:____________ (hardware/software)
Which OS_____________________
Which computer_______
Which audio interface_____
Which driver______
Which Max/MSP version________
How did you connect everything______ (cables, Audio/Midi)
Expect that most Max users don't know Cubase, but some will...
(My last touch on Cubase is almost a decade ago...)
Its good to learn not only what buttons to touch to make it sound, but
also to know why there is sound. For Max this is essential elsewise
Garageband is suited better for your needs...
Out of your question to which tutorial to go to hear sound let me assume
you didn't do them yet and you even don't know the difference between
Max and MSP... (You don't need a Midi piano to hear sound by the
way...(and it sounds better ;-))
Stefan
--
Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
--_____-----------|--------------
--(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
-- _|_)----|-----()--------------
----------()--------www.ccmix.com
Please, stop whimping. For sure, stefan & mattijs patches work fine,
they are not first timers... Having sound with Midi for the first time
in Cubase is always a nightmare. If you've find out how to do it, you'll
also be able to take the same time to understand Max a little better.
Also, "midi piano play through max out of the speakers" doesn't make any
sense at all. As ou can read in the recent answers, users here ask you
for more understandable informations. Last but not least, don't take it
as an offense, but are you sure you really need to do some MaxMSP in
your life ? if you go crazy like this on your first attempt, what will
it be next ?
best
f.e
f.e chanfrault | aka | personal computer music
> >>>>>> http://www.personal-computer-music.com
> >>>>>> |sublime music for a desperate people|
Ettin wrote:
> stephan and mattijs, your patches dont work, under any dsp or midi setting.
>
> I can play my midi piano fine through cubase, it will always make sound, so my setup and connections are fine. Why is it no one here knows how to make a midi piano play through max out to the speakers?
>
>
Quote: usdryad@hotmail.com wrote on Thu, 21 December 2006 23:39
----------------------------------------------------
> stephan and mattijs, your patches dont work, under any dsp or midi setting.
>
> I can play my midi piano fine through cubase, it will always make sound, so my setup and connections are fine. Why is it no one here knows how to make a midi piano play through max out to the speakers?
----------------------------------------------------
Uhh.. are we supposed to take offense now? Do you have any idea who you are talking to? I suppose not.
ugh sorry posted while quite drunk...still you get the idea.
just sit down quietly and play around with the thing, its really not difficult to get started. and be respectful on these boards, because the quality and willingness of people to help is better than any forum i know of, shroomery included
> Why is it no one here knows how to make a midi piano play through max out
> to the speakers?
Ok, I'll admit it. All of us have special part of DNA code that is used as a
part of superb PACE protection algorythm. If you don't have it in your
blood, max won't produce any sound.
For some money, I could send you few drops of my blood,so that you could try
it out. There are free alternatives though, checkout what this guy did:
http://www.spermcube.org/
best,
nesa
"Which Midi piano:____________ (hardware/software)
Which OS_____________________
Which computer_______
Which audio interface_____
Which driver______
Which Max/MSP version________
How did you connect everything______ (cables, Audio/Midi)"
1. There are a million midi KEYBOARDS which are the crappy non weighted keys with the generic soundbanks that will play la cucaracha that you can buy for $20 at walmart. There is only one midi PIANO (not a specific brand) a full range one with weighted keys, and a quality soundbank of 1-4 voices, w/ pedal that will cost you at least $1k.
2.XPpro
3.The one im typing this on
4. My audio interface is my audio card, audiophile 192.
5. um, the latest.
6. 4.5
7. my midi piano connects to my soundcard via a midi cable whose signal is recieved by my mother board, (pci slot 4) sent to and processed by my processors (intel 3.8ghz) which utilizes my ram (1gb corsair ddr2 800) (cause god knows my L1 and L2 caches cant hold it all) which corresponds to a collection of 1's and 0's stored on a set of magnetic platters equaling a total potential storage space of 350Gb, of which turns out to comprise both cubase (which does process this data into air vibrations called sound) and MAXMSP4.5 (which doesnt). The information processed by all these components is sent back out through my audio card on a set of mono outs to a reciever/amp through RCA's, which appear to amplify and process that data (DAC perhaps? im not familiar with the technology) out through a couple thin cables to my speakers. I suppose from there i rely on the physics of air and space to receive these vibrations through little hairs in my cochlea which convert it to brainwaves which i then perceive (i hope, or maybe the smartasses on this thread are right and ive figured away to turn this off only when using maxmsp).
so yes, if you cant understand "i want to play my midi piano through msp and out through my speakers", and by speakers i mean i dont want the signal to stop there but to actually reach my ears, then i hope this will have clarified a few things.
one thing i forgot to mention, if i were speaking of a software based midi keyboard, it would be called a softsynth.
If you're using 4.5 read "MaxGettingStarted.pdf" included in the
documentation (or click here - https://cycling74.com/download/
maxmsp456doc.zip).
Follow the instructions and everything will become clear.
If you want help stop being a D-Bag.
On Dec 22, 2006, at 12:42 PM, Ettin wrote:
>
> "Which Midi piano:____________ (hardware/software)
> Which OS_____________________
> Which computer_______
> Which audio interface_____
> Which driver______
> Which Max/MSP version________
> How did you connect everything______ (cables, Audio/Midi)"
>
> 1. There are a million midi KEYBOARDS which are the crappy non
> weighted keys with the generic soundbanks that will play la
> cucaracha that you can buy for $20 at walmart. There is only one
> midi PIANO (not a specific brand) a full range one with weighted
> keys, and a quality soundbank of 1-4 voices, w/ pedal that will
> cost you at least $1k.
>
> 2.XPpro
> 3.The one im typing this on
> 4. My audio interface is my audio card, audiophile 192.
> 5. um, the latest.
> 6. 4.5
> 7. my midi piano connects to my soundcard via a midi cable whose
> signal is recieved by my mother board, (pci slot 4) sent to and
> processed by my processors (intel 3.8ghz) which utilizes my ram
> (1gb corsair ddr2 800) (cause god knows my L1 and L2 caches cant
> hold it all) which corresponds to a collection of 1's and 0's
> stored on a set of magnetic platters equaling a total potential
> storage space of 350Gb, of which turns out to comprise both cubase
> (which does process this data into air vibrations called sound) and
> MAXMSP4.5 (which doesnt). The information processed by all these
> components is sent back out through my audio card on a set of mono
> outs to a reciever/amp through RCA's, which appear to amplify and
> process that data (DAC perhaps? im not familiar with the
> technology) out through a couple thin cables to my speakers. I
> suppose from there i rely on the physics of air and space to
> receive these vibrations through little hairs in my cochlea which
> convert it to brainwaves !
> which i then perceive (i hope, or maybe the smartasses on this
> thread are right and ive figured away to turn this off only when
> using maxmsp).
>
> so yes, if you cant understand "i want to play my midi piano
> through msp and out through my speakers", and by speakers i mean i
> dont want the signal to stop there but to actually reach my ears,
> then i hope this will have clarified a few things.
Your attitude is ridiculous. People have given you good advice and even working, simple patches and your basic attitude is that it's their fault because you don't understand the simplest midi/audio concepts, and clearly don't even know what MAX/MSP is for. There are professionals and college professors on this board...you are the one who is confused, not them.
dear Zsolt,
> one thing i forgot to mention, if i were speaking of a software based midi
> keyboard, it would be called a softsynth.
and you would be wrong.
midi keyboard usually doesn't produce any sound, it just generates some
numbers(note pitch, velocity), and that number is later sent to synth(soft
or not) which produces sound.
what you wanted to call softsynth, outside of your head is usually called
'virtual midi keyboard', so please use that for more efficient
communication.
now, if you actually reached this part of my message, let me offer you
step-by-step help, after which you should be able to get sound, but only if
you promise to go through all max pdf files afterwards, when I prove you
that program actually works. If you want to do that, let's continue this
discussion offlist, and you can start by sending me one screenshot
containing the contents of window called 'DSP Status' that you get when you
click menu Options->DSP Status...
We could also do this real-time if you have MSN messenger or equivalent
installed...
best,
nesa
"storage space of 350Gb, of which turns out to comprise both cubase (which does process this data into air vibrations called sound) and MAXMSP4.5 (which doesnt). The information processed by all these components is sent back out through my audio card"
So what is it in Cubase which actually makes the sound? In Mattijs' patch I am able to double click on the noteout object and I get a list of MIDI things which Max can communicate with. The easiest one for me to choose to get a sound is the AU DLS Synth which is the O.S.'s GM softsynth (Quicktime instruments I believe - I'm on Mac OSX.3.9). I select that, click the bang and hear a note. The same is true in tutorial 12 and then I'm able to play this sound with my MIDI piano (which in my case is an unweighted USB keyboard). Is Cubase doing something similar to access a softsynth when it makes sounds? If so can you replicate this setting in Max? I've not used Wintel for years but I remember those GM sounds to be hosted on the sound card its self and not in the OS, perhaps the audiophile 192 does not have such a beast?
I assume that when you load up tutorial 12 and play notes on your keyboard you see the pitch and velocity numbers change? If so then Max is getting the data. Then the trick is to figure out what noteout is doing with it. It looks like Cubase has built in virtual instruments (I don't know the program, I looked at their website) - Max/MSP does not. Do you have some external synth which you can hook your MIDI out from the sound card to and see if it gets the data from Max? (A bit silly to plug your controller into your computer and right back out to some external gear but at least you could trouble shoot Max's ability to communicate with your setup.)
Also, in Max, try the extras menu and the Audio Tester. Click the start message going into the dac~ and then turn on the test tones, that should at least give you some sound out of Max/MSP to prove that it is indeed and audio program :) ...though obviously not the kind of sounds you want.
Max is frustrating at first, but in a few months you'll look back at this thread and laugh! :D (I hope)
Amen!
On Dec 22, 2006, at 12:02 PM, Michael Duffy wrote:
>
> If you want help stop being a D-Bag.
>
>
>
----
Steven M. Miller
Associate Professor of Contemporary Music
College of Santa Fe
Contemporary Music Program
1600 St. Michaels Drive
Santa Fe NM 87505
http://pubweb.csf.edu/~smill
(505) 473-6197
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SFIFEM
Atrium Sound Space
OVOS
*opportunities for composers & sound artists*
> Max is frustrating at first, but in a few months you'll look back at this thread and laugh! :D (I hope)
----------------------------------------------------
thats exactly like Max is - and the MAX community in this board.
At 11:42 AM -0700 12/22/06, Ettin wrote:
[snotty "answer" to legitimate questions regarding basic setup deleted]
>so yes, if you cant understand "i want to play my midi piano through msp and out through my speakers", and by speakers i mean i dont want the signal to stop there but to actually reach my ears, then i hope this will have clarified a few things.
Wow, a lot of attitude for someone as seemingly low on clues as you seem to be.
Try following the instructions in this patch:
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
On Dec 22, 2006, at 8:23 PM, nesa wrote:
> dear Zsolt,
he he he .... you forgot to mention Solidworks.
>> D-Bag
> Even with a boring thread like this one, I learned something and
> could extend my limited english skills.
I have to say that Google saved my life again... cool new expression
for my lectures ;-)
pa
Ok, can we please move on?
usdryad, if you are still stuck, please drop us a line.
support at cycling 74 dot com
Thank you one and all for leaving this thread right here.
-A
There is still a load of ambiguity in this 'answer' to the questions.
On Dec 22, 2006, at 11:42 AM, Ettin wrote:
> 7. my midi piano connects to my soundcard via a midi cable whose
> signal is recieved by my mother board, (pci slot 4) sent to and
> processed by my processors (intel 3.8ghz) which utilizes my ram
> (1gb corsair ddr2 800) (cause god knows my L1 and L2 caches cant
> hold it all) which corresponds to a collection of 1's and 0's
> stored on a set of magnetic platters equaling a total potential
> storage space of 350Gb, of which turns out to comprise both cubase
> (which does process this data into air vibrations called sound) and
> MAXMSP4.5 (which doesnt). The information processed by all these
> components is sent back out through my audio card on a set of mono
> outs to a reciever/amp through RCA's, which appear to amplify and
> process that data (DAC perhaps? im not familiar with the
> technology) out through a couple thin cables to my speakers. I
> suppose from there i rely on the physics of air and space to
> receive these vibrations through little hairs in my cochlea which
> convert it to brainwaves !
> which i then perceive (i hope, or maybe the smartasses on this
> thread are right and ive figured away to turn this off only when
> using maxmsp).
>
This irrelevant verbiage still does not answer the basic questions.
1) Are you trying to control the keyboard from MaxMSP via MIDI (and
therefor the MIDI out from the MIDI interface goes to the MIDI in on
the keyboard, the audio output from keyboard goes directly to amps/
speakers, and you have some sort of MIDI generating patch loaded in
MaxMSP)?
2) Or are you trying to have the keyboard's MIDI out control some
sound-making process within MaxMSP (in which case the MIDI out goes
from the keyboard to the MIDI in on your MIDI interface, and you have
some sort of synthesis or sample playback patch loaded in MaxMSP
being driven by the MIDI input, and the audio out from your audio
interface needs to go to the amp/speakers)?
3) Or are you trying to process the audio from the keyboard through
MaxMSP (in which case no MIDI connections are needed, but the audio
out from the keyboard needs to go into the audio input on your audio
interface, and you need to have some sort of audio signal processing
patch loaded in MaxMSP which processes the incoming audio, and the
audio out from the audio interface goes to the amp/speaker)?
Note, this all assumes you have configured all the audio & MIDI
settings within MaxMSP correctly, which is still yet to be determined.
> so yes, if you cant understand "i want to play my midi piano
> through msp and out through my speakers", and by speakers i mean i
> dont want the signal to stop there but to actually reach my ears,
> then i hope this will have clarified a few things.
Not in the least, other than clarifying the 'attitude quotient' with
which we are dealing.
----
Steven M. Miller
Associate Professor of Contemporary Music
College of Santa Fe
Contemporary Music Program
1600 St. Michaels Drive
Santa Fe NM 87505
http://pubweb.csf.edu/~smill
(505) 473-6197
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SFIFEM
Atrium Sound Space
OVOS
*opportunities for composers & sound artists*
oh come on guys, it was not him who started beeing a
dirtbag, it was us.
it is a bit unclear for me how one can not get audio out
to work in MAX, but it is also unclear to me how one can misunderstand his request for sending audio from his piano
through the program.
maybe it is good that there are still some people out there
which do not know everything about MAX, but when people
start to get bored with MAX they start to make projects
like this: http://www.spermcube.org/
-110
"This irrelevant verbiage still does not answer the basic questions.
1) Are you trying to control the keyboard from MaxMSP via MIDI (and
therefor the MIDI out from the MIDI interface goes to the MIDI in on
the keyboard, the audio output from keyboard goes directly to amps/
speakers, and you have some sort of MIDI generating patch loaded in
MaxMSP)?
2) Or are you trying to have the keyboard's MIDI out control some
sound-making process within MaxMSP (in which case the MIDI out goes
from the keyboard to the MIDI in on your MIDI interface, and you have
some sort of synthesis or sample playback patch loaded in MaxMSP
being driven by the MIDI input, and the audio out from your audio
interface needs to go to the amp/speakers)?
3) Or are you trying to process the audio from the keyboard through
MaxMSP (in which case no MIDI connections are needed, but the audio
out from the keyboard needs to go into the audio input on your audio
interface, and you need to have some sort of audio signal processing
patch loaded in MaxMSP which processes the incoming audio, and the
audio out from the audio interface goes to the amp/speaker)?
Note, this all assumes you have configured all the audio & MIDI
settings within MaxMSP correctly, which is still yet to be determined."
1.Why would i try to control the controller(piano) with anything but my hands? in what application would one use a computer program to control a midi piano? The only one i can think of is one of those player piano that looks like an invisible person is playing it.
2. yes, this would be logical, and is correct.
3. How would you imagine data getting from a midi keyboard to my audio interface in this setup without a midi cable, FM transistor?
You all are wondering what i play through cubase to make a sound? Vst instruments and samplers, though i can use the Microsoft GS wavetable SW synth that is microsoft's standard synth. Basically anything that can generate a sound works through cubase, and all i have to select to make it happen is my audiointerface ("audiophile 192 MIDI 1/2") as my input and whatever VST as my output. viola, simple as that.
------------------
@ Chris Muir
your patch doesnt show input OR output signals, at least tutorial 12 showed that it was recieving notedata, even if i still dont know where that note data went. Should the input signal meter be showing activity with the reception of notedata?
-----------------
ok, even when i set my DSP to "none" as in "no driver selected" i will still recieve notedata displayed in tutorial 12 and in the MIDITester. I tried every DSP setting with Chris Muir's patch and got no input or output signal, even though im recieving notedata. In the MIDITester window my output has 3 options "Micorsoft synthesizer" (whatever that is) "delta AP 192 MIDI" (my soundcard interface) and "Microsoft GS wavetable SW synth" (windows built-in synth). Reguardless of the DSP setting, if i set it to the delta or wavetable synth output and hit the bang icon next to it, it always goes back to the "Microsoft synthesizer". Im not really sure what the hell that is about, nothing by that name exists except it seems in MAX. Im guessing the MAX programmers put that there instead of just writing "none".
Well, im glad to know im the only one in the world using windowsXP, a midipiano, and a delta audiophile 192 soundcard connected to a soundsystem, its such a unique experience having my generic setup different from everyone elses generic setup.
my 2 cents contribution...
maybe you should have a look (and ear) in the examples folder in your max/msp application folder.
specially in "sequencing-looping" and "sampling".
then you could have an idea about sound processing in max.
and before to spend time to learn max/msp (and it takes lot's of time), it's maybe two questions to ask to yourself:
- what i want exactly do ?
- does it already exist a tool to do it ? (if yes don't waste your time with max/msp). there's lot's of tools to produce sound (reaktor, etc...). but you already knows that, i suppose.
i hope it helps.
x'cuse my poor english...
the right sentence is probably:
what do I want to make exactly?
Please kill this thread.
b
--
barry threw :: sound | (if you would see the stars clearly,
http://www.barrythrew.com | look hard at the surrounding darkness)
bthrew(at)gmail(dot)com | -Ooka Makoto
857-544-3967 |
Ah... so the fog is starting to lift. You don't, in fact, want to "make a midi piano play through max out to the speakers". It sounds like you want to use your midi piano as a controller keyboard to control softsynths in Max. The patch I sent assumed you were routing the audio out of your midi piano into the computer, and you wanted to process it somehow in Max/MSP.
Here's simple patch that will play four voices of just about the simplest synth voice imaginable. Setting this up on your machine is a several step process.
First make a new directory and save this first part as "StupidSynthVoice".
Second, save this part as "StupidSynth" in the same directory as "StupidSynthVoice":
Third, close, then reopen, the StupidSynth patch. Now, assuming that your audio I/O is set properly (as described in the last patch I sent), you should be able to select your MIDI input device and play this synth.
===========
Now, to address some of your recent statements -
At 8:55 PM -0700 12/22/06, Ettin wrote:
>1.Why would i try to control the controller(piano) with anything but my hands? in what application would one use a computer program to control a midi piano? The only one i can think of is one of those player piano that looks like an invisible person is playing it.
Well, the common usage is to use the sounds available from your piano in part of a larger arrangement of a MIDI song. Traditionally, you would turn Local Control Off on your MIDI keyboard so that the sounds and the black and white keyboard were de-coupled, allowing you to play the keyboard without triggering the internal sounds, while still being able to trigger the internal sounds over MIDI.
>3. How would you imagine data getting from a midi keyboard to my audio interface in this setup without a midi cable, FM transistor?
The question you are replying to was trying to clear up one simple fact, which is only now sort of clear to me: Are you trying to use the piano as a controller or as an audio source? (are you trying to process the piano audio, or drive other things via MIDI?) From your recent statements I've come to the conclusion that you want to use your MIDI piano as a controller.
I hope it's clear to you by now that we are not trying to jerk you around, but that the way that you've been communicating has not been clear at all. We have been asking honest questions trying to get enough information to be able to help you.
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
One small bug in my SimpleVoice patch: I create a menu of output
devices, instead of a menu of input devices.
To fix this, edit the patch, and change the message box that is
hitting the midiinfo object from a 1 to a -1. This is the top-most
message in this patch, so it should be easy to find.
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
On Dec 22, 2006, at 8:55 PM, Ettin wrote:
>
> 1.Why would i try to control the controller(piano) with anything
> but my hands? in what application would one use a computer program
> to control a midi piano? The only one i can think of is one of
> those player piano that looks like an invisible person is playing it.
There are quite a number of composers working with computer-driven
pianos (of both electronic and acoustic varieties), sometimes in
response to live input from a pianist, sometimes not. You might
investigate & listen to some of the work of George Lewis, Chris
Brown, David Rosenboom, Kyle Gann, etc. For actual player piano
music, you'd possibly be amazed at the player piano studies of Conlon
Nancarrow. James Tenney composed a gorgeous piece for player piano
tuned to the harmonic series.
>
> 2. yes, this would be logical, and is correct.
They are all logical, actually. It just depends on what you are
trying to accomplish. See below for more info.
>
> 3. How would you imagine data getting from a midi keyboard to my
> audio interface in this setup without a midi cable, FM transistor?
In this scenario, it's not 'data' per se from the piano, but the
actual audio signal itself which is input to the computer through the
audio interface for processing within MaxMSP (or other such software
tools). Simple examples would be to create reverbs, filters, pitch
shifters, distortion, etc. within MaxMSP for real-time processing of
the piano sound. Quite a few composers are working with real-time
processing of acoustic instruments, voices, and other sound sources.
I have a piece, for example, for real-time DSP of multi-channel
feedback.
> ok, even when i set my DSP to "none" as in "no driver selected" i
> will still recieve notedata displayed in tutorial 12 and in the
> MIDITester. I tried every DSP setting with Chris Muir's patch and
> got no input or output signal, even though im recieving notedata.
> In the MIDITester window my output has 3 options "Micorsoft
> synthesizer" (whatever that is) "delta AP 192 MIDI" (my soundcard
> interface) and "Microsoft GS wavetable SW synth" (windows built-in
> synth). Reguardless of the DSP setting, if i set it to the delta or
> wavetable synth output and hit the bang icon next to it, it always
> goes back to the "Microsoft synthesizer". Im not really sure what
> the hell that is about, nothing by that name exists except it seems
> in MAX. Im guessing the MAX programmers put that there instead of
> just writing "none".
I think the key to the whole confusion is that you have been unclear
about specifying what you are doing, up until now. The DSP settings
in MaxMSP have no effect on the MIDI routing.
Since it's now clear that you are trying to use MIDI from your piano
to control sound-generating patches within MaxMSP you can either
create a synthesis patch which will send out audio in response to the
incoming MIDI data or open a VST instrument within a MaxMSP patch and
control it via the incoming MIDI data. In this case you will indeed
need to configure both the MIDI (for the incoming data) and DSP (for
the outgoing audio) settings in MaxMSP before the patches will
operate correctly.
----
Steven M. Miller
Associate Professor of Contemporary Music
College of Santa Fe
Contemporary Music Program
1600 St. Michaels Drive
Santa Fe NM 87505
http://pubweb.csf.edu/~smill
(505) 473-6197
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SFIFEM
Atrium Sound Space
OVOS
*opportunities for composers & sound artists*
Whats with the jerkoff's saying "kill this thread", is that the way the community helps people get on their feet around here?
Ok, so now everyone understands me, i want to use my piano as a controller to trigger a synth patch (whose creation is my aim in learning MAX). Is what i want to do already exist? no, see "Nobukazu Takemura", theres no other program under the sun that can even come close to what he does with MSP. Im not saying i want to mimic his sound, but i want to "spiral out" in the manner that he did.
I have been concerned with DSP because max is obviously recieving notedata which means all the input is working correctly (i think), so this leads me to believe something is amiss with the output.
@Chris muir
nope, no luck with either your on-screen keyboard or my piano. Volume turned all the way up on your patch (i can play music on my computer so theres no doubt my setup is working fine), clicked the audio icon, did the fix you mentioned, got nothing, even under every DSP setting (even if that doesnt matter!).
So you all are the computer experts, where is the dam in this stream of information?
The dam is your intentional ignorance of the basics of this programming environment. People have been extremely generous and patient with you despite your refusal to figure things out yourself. Say "thank you", do the tutorials and maybe the next time you come to this list/forum for help they will remember that you did show some appreciation and gratitude in the end and help you again.
best,
dan
-----Original Message-----
From: Ettin
Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 13:24:12
Subject: [maxmsp] Re: Re: This is an "audio" program right?
Whats with the jerkoff's saying "kill this thread", is that the way the community helps people get on their feet around here?
Ok, so now everyone understands me, i want to use my piano as a controller to trigger a synth patch (whose creation is my aim in learning MAX). Is what i want to do already exist? no, see "Nobukazu Takemura", theres no other program under the sun that can even come close to what he does with MSP. Im not saying i want to mimic his sound, but i want to "spiral out" in the manner that he did.
I have been concerned with DSP because max is obviously recieving notedata which means all the input it working correctly (i think), so this leads me to believe something is amiss with the output.
@Chris muir
nope, no luck with either your on-screen keyboard or my piano. Volume turned all the way up on your patch (i can play music on my computer so theres no doubt my setup is working fine), clicked the audio icon, did the fix you mentioned, got nothing, even under every DSP setting (even if that doesnt matter!).
So you all are the computer experts, where is the dam in this stream of information?
At 1:24 PM -0700 12/23/06, Ettin wrote:
>Whats with the jerkoff's saying "kill this thread", is that the way the community helps people get on their feet around here?
Well, in my opinion, you haven't been the easiest person to try to help. Perhaps English is not your native language, but I've perceived your communications as confrontational. In my view, the best way to ask for help is with humility.
>I have been concerned with DSP because max is obviously recieving notedata which means all the input it working correctly (i think), so this leads me to believe something is amiss with the output.
>
>@Chris muir
>
>nope, no luck with either your on-screen keyboard or my piano. Volume turned all the way up on your patch (i can play music on my computer so theres no doubt my setup is working fine), clicked the audio icon, did the fix you mentioned, got nothing, even under every DSP setting (even if that doesnt matter!).
Well, despite your protestations to the contrary, if the on-screen keyboard does not work, there's something wrong with your setup _somewhere_. Do _any_ Max/MSP patches make sound for you? If this one doesn't make sound when the speaker is highlighted, there is something fundamentally wrong with your Max DSP settings or your basic audio setup.
>So you all are the computer experts, where is the dam in this stream of information?
This is a good example of being confrontational, IMO.
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
that "jerkoff" happens to be Andrews Pask, part of Cycling 74's very patient and gracious tech support (https://cycling74.com/twiki/bin/view/Company/People). It would be in your best interest to heed his advice and go ahead and e-mail them. As a paying customer, Cycling 74 will be more than willing to help you get started.
The following patch should allow you to verify whether the MIDI input
& audio output are working properly.
Assuming your MIDI & audio hardware & software connections, drivers,
interfaces, etc. are correctly configured, the following patch should
take MIDI from any input source, use the MIDI data to control the
pitch of an oscillator, and send the audio out to your amp/speakers.
If it does not do so, there is something amiss in your configuration
of MaxMSP or elsewhere.
The patch will display the incoming note number, velocity, and MIDI
channel in the number boxes. The audio level will be displayed on
the meter below the fader. Just double-click on the 'notein' object
and select your MIDI piano, then click on the ezdac~ object to turn
on DSP, fade up the gain~ object, and play your keyboard.
If you don't get MIDI in, you need to double check the MIDI
configuration of MaxMSP to make sure that it is properly set up. See
the 'MIDI Set up' under the 'file' menu.
If you get MIDI in but no audio out, you need to double check the
audio driver settings in MaxMSP. See the 'DSP Status' under the
'Options' menu. Is the correct driver listed next to 'driver'? Is
your audio interface listed next to 'Input Device'? Is it also listed
next to 'Output Device'?
For detailed audio & MIDI setup instructions, see the Max
Fundamentals, Max Tutorials, and MSP Tutorials & Topics files in your
'Documentation' folder inside the MaxMSP application folder.
----
Steven M. Miller
Associate Professor of Contemporary Music
College of Santa Fe
Contemporary Music Program
1600 St. Michaels Drive
Santa Fe NM 87505
http://pubweb.csf.edu/~smill
(505) 473-6197
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SFIFEM
Atrium Sound Space
OVOS
*opportunities for composers & sound artists*
>>> Ok, so now everyone understands me, i want to use my piano as a controller to trigger a synth patch
then you should have said it like this.
"that "jerkoff" happens to be Andrews Pask, part of Cycling 74's very patient and gracious tech support"
jesus, i dont even want to bother with tech support if they are that rude.
@chrismuir
your patch produces a tone.
@smill
your patch doesnt paste anything into the patcher window, is just makes an astrisk appears next to the "untitled" part of the window like "untitled*". Perhaps because your working with v2 and im using v4.5?
there should be enough clues here to pinpoint whats going wrong. Anyways i really do appreciate the help, its just frustrating having this roadblock impede my trek up what appears to be a vertical learning curve.
At 10:14 PM -0700 12/23/06, Ettin wrote:
>jesus, i dont even want to bother with tech support if they are that rude.
I don't think what Andrew wrote was rude at all. He merely suggested that it might be better to open a dialog directly with Cycling74 tech support, and not take up Forum cycles with a thread that was threatening to devolve into name calling, which I think it was starting to do when he said that.
>@chrismuir
>
>your patch produces a tone.
I don't understand how this patch can produce a tone, and my previous example did not. At any rate, here's one final patch that is a monophonic version of the StupidSynth patch:
>@smill
>
>your patch doesnt paste anything into the patcher window, is just makes an astrisk appears next to the "untitled" part of the window like "untitled*". Perhaps because your working with v2 and im using v4.5?
Steven's patch loads fine here.
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
Just to be clear, that other "jerkoff" was me.
I'm not nice. I'm mean. And I think your attitude was bullshit.
Grow up and be respectful to a forum and you won't get flack back.
b
Chris Muir wrote:
> At 10:14 PM -0700 12/23/06, Ettin wrote:
>> jesus, i dont even want to bother with tech support if they are that rude.
>
> I don't think what Andrew wrote was rude at all. He merely suggested that it might be better to open a dialog directly with Cycling74 tech support, and not take up Forum cycles with a thread that was threatening to devolve into name calling, which I think it was starting to do when he said that.
>
>
>> @chrismuir
>>
>> your patch produces a tone.
>
> I don't understand how this patch can produce a tone, and my previous example did not. At any rate, here's one final patch that is a monophonic version of the StupidSynth patch:
>
> #P window setfont "Sans Serif" 9.;
> #P flonum 93 372 35 9 0 0 0 3 0 0 0 221 221 221 222 222 222 0 0 0;
> #P window linecount 1;
> #P comment 35 302 39 196617 "VCA";
> #P newex 76 110 62 196617 stripnote;
> #P comment 15 66 65 196617 Input Device;
> #P hidden message 125 46 19 196617 -1;
> #P user umenu 76 64 100 196647 1 64 80 1;
> #X add "IAC Driver Bus 1";
> #X add "to MaxMSP 1";
> #X add "to MaxMSP 2";
> #P hidden newex 76 45 45 196617 midiinfo;
> #P user kslider 197 65 54 0 48 48 31 12 0 128 128 128 128 128 128 255 255 255 0 0 0 0 0 0;
> #P newex 76 90 116 196617 notein;
> #P hidden message 147 387 26 196617 127;
> #P hidden newex 147 43 48 196617 loadbang;
> #P user ezdac~ 76 520 120 553 0;
> #P user gain~ 76 432 23 56 158 0 1.071519 7.94321 10.;
> #P flonum 76 229 44 9 0 0 0 3 0 0 0 221 221 221 222 222 222 0 0 0;
> #P comment 17 210 59 196617 Simple Osc;
> #P newex 76 166 27 196617 t i b;
> #P flonum 128 323 35 9 0 0 0 3 0 0 0 221 221 221 222 222 222 0 0 0;
> #P newex 128 303 87 196617 scale 0 127 0. 1.;
> #P newex 93 351 45 196617 * 1.;
> #P newex 76 209 31 196617 mtof;
> #P number 128 148 35 9 0 0 0 3 0 0 0 221 221 221 222 222 222 0 0 0;
> #P number 76 148 35 9 0 0 64 3 0 0 0 221 221 221 222 222 222 0 0 0;
> #P message 355 254 40 196617 0. 350;
> #P newex 355 234 32 196617 del 5;
> #P flonum 337 295 35 9 0 0 0 3 0 0 0 221 221 221 222 222 222 0 0 0;
> #P button 337 207 15 0;
> #P message 337 254 17 196617 1.;
> #P newex 337 275 50 196617 line 0. 5;
> #P newex 76 393 27 196617 *~;
> #P newex 76 248 40 196617 cycle~;
> #P comment 277 208 59 196617 Simple env;
> #P comment 49 148 30 196617 Note;
> #P comment 164 148 29 196617 Velo;
> #P user panel 273 195 130 132;
> #X brgb 230 234 129;
> #X frgb 0 0 0;
> #X border 1;
> #X rounded 13;
> #X shadow 0;
> #X done;
> #P window linecount 2;
> #P comment 140 348 72 196617 Scale Envelope by Velocity;
> #P user panel 33 289 192 127;
> #X brgb 142 144 221;
> #X frgb 0 0 0;
> #X border 1;
> #X rounded 13;
> #X shadow 0;
> #X done;
> #P user panel 14 195 111 87;
> #X brgb 115 232 138;
> #X frgb 0 0 0;
> #X border 1;
> #X rounded 13;
> #X shadow 0;
> #X done;
> #P connect 36 0 8 1;
> #P connect 18 0 36 0;
> #P connect 8 0 24 0;
> #P connect 7 0 8 0;
> #P connect 24 0 25 0;
> #P connect 24 0 25 1;
> #P hidden connect 26 0 32 0;
> #P hidden connect 26 0 27 0;
> #P connect 11 0 10 0;
> #P connect 11 0 13 0;
> #P hidden connect 30 0 31 0;
> #P fasten 31 1 28 0 171 85 81 85;
> #P connect 28 0 34 0;
> #P fasten 29 0 15 0 202 135 81 135;
> #P lcolor 7;
> #P connect 34 0 15 0;
> #P lcolor 7;
> #P connect 15 0 21 0;
> #P connect 21 0 17 0;
> #P connect 17 0 23 0;
> #P connect 23 0 7 0;
> #P hidden connect 27 0 24 0;
> #P fasten 12 0 18 0 342 345 98 345;
> #P connect 28 1 34 1;
> #P fasten 29 1 16 0 529 142 133 142;
> #P lcolor 6;
> #P connect 34 1 16 0;
> #P lcolor 6;
> #P connect 16 0 19 0;
> #P connect 19 0 20 0;
> #P connect 20 0 18 1;
> #P hidden connect 32 0 30 1;
> #P fasten 21 1 11 0 98 186 342 186;
> #P connect 14 0 9 0;
> #P connect 10 0 9 0;
> #P connect 9 0 12 0;
> #P connect 13 0 14 0;
> #P window clipboard copycount 37;
>
>
>
>> @smill
>>
>> your patch doesnt paste anything into the patcher window, is just makes an astrisk appears next to the "untitled" part of the window like "untitled*". Perhaps because your working with v2 and im using v4.5?
>
> Steven's patch loads fine here.
>
>
> -C
>
--
barry threw :: sound | (if you would see the stars clearly,
http://www.barrythrew.com | look hard at the surrounding darkness)
bthrew(at)gmail(dot)com | -Ooka Makoto
857-544-3967 |
@chrismuir
your patch works!!! i can play your mono synth patch with my keyboard. It doesnt seem to make a difference which output i select in that dropdown menu. This looks really complicated compared to the simple notein-noteout that everyone claims should accomplish what this patch does. I doubt theres a tutorial that can explain this though.
So does anyone have any clue why this patch works and all the others dont? It will be important to know because my generic setup is different from everyone elses generic setup and i will have to take that into consideration when making a patch.
@chrismuir
The stupidsynth one is working now.....
Am i supposed to restart max everytime i change a setting? i cant think of anything i changed though besides pressing AUTOSETUP in the midi setup menu, but it didnt seem change anything when i pressed it yesterday. strange.
Ok, so you are the most intelligent one here, what is the most fundamental part of the stupidsynth/monosynth patches? Like what MUST i put in everytime to make a patch use my piano as a controller and get audio to come out?
thanks again for helping me get this to work, now i can resume the tutorials knowing that it wont all be in vain.
At 12:09 PM -0700 12/24/06, Ettin wrote:
>your patch works!!! i can play your mono synth patch with my keyboard.
Good.
>This looks really complicated compared to the simple notein-noteout that everyone claims should accomplish what this patch does.
Well, all patch suggestions before we really understood what you were trying to do (only a few messages back in this thread), should probably be ignored, for now. Most of this thread was trying to solve the problems we thought you were asking about, not the problem as it eventually emerged from the fog.
I didn't try them all, but my guess is that all the contributed patches work, and solve the problem that their creators thought you were having, just not the problem that it turned out you were really having. For example, the notein -> noteout solution works fine for gathering notes from one MIDI device, and sending them to another MIDI device, which is certainly one interpretation of your problem, as originally stated... just not the real problem as it eventually became known.
Any substantial Max patch will seem complicated until you really understand it (btw, this monophonic StupidSynth patch is not complicated at all). Many people are successfully making _very_ large systems with Max/MSP.
>I doubt theres a tutorial that can explain this though.
Now that you know it can be done, you need to work on figuring out how it all works. In this, the tutorials are your best friend. Until you understand the tutorials, you will not get very far, and I also suspect you will not get too much help here, on the forum, until you work your way through them.
The tutorials will make all of this clear, eventually. Start with the Max tutorials, then proceed to the MSP tutorials. Be patient. Don't try and run before you can walk. The goal of the tutorials is to teach you the basics, not to try and solve your specific problems.
>So does anyone have any clue why this patch works and all the others dont? It will be important to know because my generic setup is different from everyone elses generic setup and i will have to take that into consideration when making a patch.
Remember, most of the suggestions on this thread were before we sussed out what you were on about. There have only been a couple suggestions that address your real question. Once you get a little more comfortable with Max/MSP, I would work backwards looking again at Steven Miller's patch (which is not too different from the monophonic StupidSynth I just provided), and try and figure out why that one didn't work for you. Then, go back to the polyphonic version of my StupidSynth patch, and try and figure out what went wrong there (although the use of the poly~ object makes somewhat more complicated). These patches both work here, so I _strongly_ suspect something went wrong at your end.
In a two or three months, after you've internalized the tutorials and played some more with Max/MSP, I hope you look back on this as a somewhat rocky start, but can't remember what you thought was so hard.
See you in the spring,
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
At 12:34 PM -0700 12/24/06, Ettin wrote:
>@chrismuir
>
>The stupidsynth one is working now.....
The polyphonic version? Good (it should).
>Am i supposed to restart max everytime i change a setting?
No.
>Ok, so you are the most intelligent one here,
Perhaps, but probably not. The most patient, maybe...
>what is the most fundamental part of the stupidsynth/monosynth patches? Like what MUST i put in everytime to make a patch use my piano as a controller and get audio to come out?
You can't be successful using Max/MSP approaching it as a series of recipes, imo. You MUST learn enough about the program to realize what is needed for any given thing you are trying to accomplish with Max, if you are going to continue to use it.
>thanks again for helping me get this to work, now i can resume the tutorials knowing that it wont all be in vain.
Please.
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
I figured out why your stupidsynth patch didnt work for me originally and why none of the previous patches would have worked even if they should have worked. I had to ghost my comp back to a fresh install today, and i load max up, clicked auto-setup in the midisetup panel, then proceeded to load your monosynth patch. It worked, and so i checked my DSP settings to set it to my soundcard's ASIO driver for best latency, go back into your patch and got no sound whatsoever. So i restarted max, left the settings as they were, loaded the monosynth and it worked. So apparently when you change your DSP settings, you have to restart max, even if your changing from one working driver to another.
anyways,
Merry Christmas, may we all spend this day reflecting upon its purpose: to celebrate the birth of Santa Claus.
And a happy Kwanzaa to all the technical support people at cycling74.
Do you, by any chance, use MaxMSP demo??
If you do, this is normal demo behaviour. You can start DSP only once
per restart - after that, no sound!
On Dec 25, 2006, at 6:43 AM, Ettin wrote:
>
> I figured out why your stupidsynth patch didnt work for me
> originally and why none of the previous patches would have worked
> even if they should have worked. I had to ghost my comp back to a
> fresh install today, and i load max up, clicked auto-setup in the
> midisetup panel, then proceeded to load your monosynth patch. It
> worked, and so i checked my DSP settings to set it to my
> soundcard's ASIO driver for best latency, go back into your patch
> and got no sound whatsoever. So i restarted max, left the settings
> as they were, loaded the monosynth and it worked. So apparently
> when you change your DSP settings, you have to restart max, even if
> your changing from one working driver to another.
>
> anyways,
>
> Merry Christmas, may we all spend this day reflecting upon its
> purpose: to celebrate the birth of Santa Claus.
>
> And a happy Kwanzaa to all the technical support people at cycling74.
that really surprises me.
I often use a demo version during workshops and I never noticed such
a limitation
//yac
On 25 Dec 2006, at 11:20, klif wrote:
> Do you, by any chance, use MaxMSP demo??
>
> If you do, this is normal demo behaviour. You can start DSP only
> once per restart - after that, no sound!
Hm, not shure myself anymore. I mostly use Jitter, but I remember
that this was the case.
Maybe someone at Cycling shoud comment??
On Dec 25, 2006, at 11:37 AM, yacine sebti wrote:
> that really surprises me.
> I often use a demo version during workshops and I never noticed
> such a limitation
>
> //yac
>
> On 25 Dec 2006, at 11:20, klif wrote:
>
>> Do you, by any chance, use MaxMSP demo??
>>
>> If you do, this is normal demo behaviour. You can start DSP only
>> once per restart - after that, no sound!
>
That happens if you have max but not msp license, if I remember correctly.
During the demo period, you actually have a kind of 30day license, so
everything is the same as in fully licensed max/msp.
>> I often use a demo version during workshops and I never noticed such a
>> limitation
>This looks really complicated compared to the simple >notein-noteout that everyone claims should accomplish what this >patch does.
if anyone ever told you to use [noteout] to produce sound
he/she was a bigger nerd than you are.
Troll alert.
I am amazed how everybody here was insulted by this Zsolt. I could
understand C74 needs customers, but this one should have been _banned
since the beginning. He has been impolite, disrespectful, arrogant and
moreover, he seems to be terribly stupid, as a computer user and as a
human being. Moving to a forum was, indeed, not a very good idea, as we
were *a lot* to warn a year ago. But as we're now supposed to be on a
forum, there should be also an Admin to short-circuit this kind of
behavior sooner. We all here have other things to do than to begin the
job his parents haven't done.
f.e
f.e chanfrault | aka | personal computer music
> >>>>>> http://www.personal-computer-music.com
> >>>>>> |sublime music for a desperate people|
Chuck Ritola wrote:
> Troll alert.
>
>
f.e wrote:
> I am amazed how everybody here was insulted by this Zsolt. I could
> understand C74 needs customers, but this one should have been _banned
> since the beginning. He has been impolite, disrespectful, arrogant and
> moreover, he seems to be terribly stupid, as a computer user and as a
> human being. Moving to a forum was, indeed, not a very good idea, as we
> were *a lot* to warn a year ago. But as we're now supposed to be on a
> forum, there should be also an Admin to short-circuit this kind of
> behavior sooner.
Hey f.e. --
I know that you are this "old-timer" mailing list user and all, but I'm
surprised that you still haven't learned after all these years to not
feed the trolls. And, frankly, _enough_ with the "we warned you about
the forums and how it wouldn't be a good idea". If it hasn't been made
abundantly clear by now by the continued existence of the forums, we
think they've been a great idea, an absolutely brilliant idea, and
they're never going away. Never. So enough with the empty, hollow,
I-Told-You-Sos. You're solidly in the minority with that viewpoint...and
the whole "I understand C74 needs customers" nonsense -- that's just
downright insulting. Businesses don't succeed by being "more 3l33t than
thou". What's next? Pre-screening customers before they buy our software?
Believe it or not, Cycling expects this community to be self-regulating,
and although you would probably beg to differ, I think this thread is an
example of how the self-regulation works. I just read through the
thread, beginning to end, and what I saw was someone who is very new to
Max/MSP and possibly making music on their computer in general, and I
saw some honest attempts to help along with some awfully hostile
statements. We shouldn't be surprised that someone responds poorly as
Ettin did. In the end though, he seems to have figured it out, and that
was a result of the people choosing to be patient and take the time to
help Ettin figure it out, not by the insults and the suggestions to ban.
> We all here have other things to do than to begin the
> job his parents haven't done.
I would say the same, but would direct my statement to those of you who
fed the trolls. Believe it or not, some of us at Cycling like to relax
during the holidays, not babysit the discussions.
If people want to make this community better, you can start by being a
bright and shining light of how one is supposed to behave, rather than
by being the opposite.
Happy holidays,
w
...and the RSS feeds work quite well, I might add.
I honestly don't miss the digests any more, and I
might have thought of myself as a digest partisan,
of sorts.
At 12:31 PM -0700 12/26/06, Wallace Winfrey wrote:
>I just read through the
>thread, beginning to end, and what I saw was someone who is very new to
>Max/MSP and possibly making music on their computer in general, and I
>saw some honest attempts to help along with some awfully hostile
>statements.
I think that there was a fair amount of miscommunication and petty behavior from all involved; Ettin was certainly not blameless, and I stooped lower than I would have liked, for example (even _after_ I discarded some of my initial responses). The reason I stuck with it is that it seemed like Ettin was really trying to get things working, but was just impatient with the progress. The fact that at least some of the tutorials had been worked through before posting, I took as a good sign.
>We shouldn't be surprised that someone responds poorly as
>Ettin did. In the end though, he seems to have figured it out, and that
>was a result of the people choosing to be patient and take the time to
>help Ettin figure it out, not by the insults and the suggestions to ban.
My guess is the Ettin is some combination of young, maybe a non-native English speaker, somewhat impatient, a little arrogant, etc... and some of these attributes really seemed to combine to rub the forum the wrong way.
In my role as programming manager at various companies, I've hired _lots_ of programmers. All of them have been smart, and many of the younger ones have gotten used to being the smartest person in the room, up to that point. Once they get hired at a place that has a good team of programmers, it's always interesting to see how the noob deals with the fact that they are no longer going to be the smartest person in the room. Some people deal with it gracefully realizing that they can learn from their new peers, some lash out and fight against it, in extreme cases even retreating to a field where they can once again be _the_ smart guy, instead of _a_ smart guy.
But all that said, I sensed that Ettin had a real desire to get things to a point where he/she was comfortable investing the time to move forward w/ Max/MSP. I guess my hope is that Ettin takes the time to really learn Max/MSP and becomes a contributing member here.
-C
--
Chris Muir | "There are many futures and only one status quo.
cbm@well.com | This is why conservatives mostly agree,
http://www.xfade.com | and radicals always argue." - Brian Eno
Absolutely agree with this - the lack of a digest delivery option is
a major drawback on this email list, due to the high volume (which
should be a *good* thing).
On Dec 26, 2006, at 6:55 AM, Kasper T Toeplitz wrote:
>
> can't you bring the digest back?
>
----
Steven M. Miller
Associate Professor of Contemporary Music
College of Santa Fe
Contemporary Music Program
1600 St. Michaels Drive
Santa Fe NM 87505
http://pubweb.csf.edu/~smill
(505) 473-6197
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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