Reso Kiknadze

i've got a problem joining lists and need your help:

is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists 

with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists  
with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

-------------------------------------
Reso Kiknadze
composition * saxophone * electronics
Eschenburgstr. 13a
D-23568 Luebeck
GERMANY
Phone/Fax: +49 451 3885946
Mobile: +49 173 3467966
Email: reso_k@web.de
URL: www.reso-kiknadze.de


komma-between-joined-lists

Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10

----------------------------------------------------

> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists 

> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

I'm not sure I get what you want to achieve... Where do you want the coma to be kept ?

In the meantime, I think sprintf should work.

Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10
----------------------------------------------------

> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists  
> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

that cansels the comma out as a special caracter ,

the comma should just pre preceded with  

that cansels the comma out as a special caracter ,


just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each 

containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number destinared 

0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69 100 

detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via 'write') a 

it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate 

understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at zero 

and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...

iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and track 

informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but before 

seeking for them -i'd like to figure out why detonate does not work...

anyway, thnaks for your responce/question...

> Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10

> ----------------------------------------------------

>> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists

>> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

> I'm not sure I get what you want to achieve... Where do you want 

> In the meantime, I think sprintf should work.

just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each   
containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number destinared  
for detonate,

0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69 100  
100 1 2

detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via 'write') a  
multitrack midi file.
it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate  
understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at zero  
and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...

iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and track  
informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but before  
seeking for them -i'd like to figure out why detonate does not work...

-------------------------------------
Reso Kiknadze
composition * saxophone * electronics
Eschenburgstr. 13a
D-23568 Luebeck
GERMANY
Phone/Fax: +49 451 3885946
Mobile: +49 173 3467966
Email: reso_k@web.de
URL: www.reso-kiknadze.de

>
> Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
>> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists
>> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?
>
> Hello,
>
> I'm not sure I get what you want to achieve... Where do you want  
> the coma to be kept ?
>
> In the meantime, I think sprintf should work.
>
> Best,
> Julien.
>
>


the comma is a feature of the message box.

it enables you to enter several lists in one message box.

if you are able to create a list consisting of several smaller lists 

if you were to send this long list to detonate, denonate will treat 

not as a series of smaller lists. in other words:

detonate will not treat it as a series of delta-time, pitch velocity 

On 13-feb-2007, at 17:32, Reso Kiknadze wrote:

> just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each 

> containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number destinared 

> 0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69 100 

> detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via 'write') 

> it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate 

> understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at zero 

> and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...

> iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and track 

> informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but before 

> seeking for them -i'd like to figure out why detonate does not work...

> anyway, thnaks for your responce/question...

beware of the following pitfall.
the comma is a feature of the message box.
it enables you to enter several lists in one message box.

the comma is NOT a feature of lists.
if you are able to create  a list consisting of several smaller lists  
separated by commas,
it is just that, one long list.

if you were to send this long list to detonate, denonate will treat  
it as one long list,
not as a series of smaller lists. in other words:
detonate will not treat it as a series of delta-time, pitch velocity  
and track number,
as you are trying to do.

> oh,
>
> just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each   
> containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number destinared  
> for detonate,
>
> e.g
>
> 0 60 100 100 1 1
>
> and
>
> 250 60 100 100 1 1
> etc.
>
> resulting
>
> 0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69 100  
> 100 1 2
>
>
> detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via 'write')  
> a multitrack midi file.
> it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate  
> understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at zero  
> and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...
>
> iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and track  
> informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but before  
> seeking for them -i'd like to figure out why detonate does not work...
>
> anyway, thnaks for your responce/question...
>
> ;-)
>
> reagrds,
> reso
>
>
> -------------------------------------
> Reso Kiknadze
> composition * saxophone * electronics
> Eschenburgstr. 13a
> D-23568 Luebeck
> GERMANY
> Phone/Fax: +49 451 3885946
> Mobile: +49 173 3467966
> Email: reso_k@web.de
> URL: www.reso-kiknadze.de
>
>
>
> Am 13.02.2007 um 14:32 schrieb jln:
>
>>
>> Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10
>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>
>>> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists
>>> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> I'm not sure I get what you want to achieve... Where do you want  
>> the coma to be kept ?
>>
>> In the meantime, I think sprintf should work.
>>
>> Best,
>> Julien.
>>
>>
>


in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help" there is a script-like 

and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of lists 

it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track 

giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times are 

so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the same 

delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one another 

!!!!!!!! exp_message 1000 60 127 500 1 2, 0 60 127 500 1 4, 0 63 

120 1000 1 1, 1000 66 100 400 1 2, 1000 71 95 2000 1 1, 1000 66 100 

i coud live even with this restriction of detonate, if i would be 

able to join lists that i get as output of my former calculations and

thanks and sorry for disturbing with this weired stuff :-)

Am 13.02.2007 um 20:26 schrieb jennek geels:

> the comma is a feature of the message box.

> it enables you to enter several lists in one message box.

> if you are able to create a list consisting of several smaller 

> if you were to send this long list to detonate, denonate will treat 

> not as a series of smaller lists. in other words:

> detonate will not treat it as a series of delta-time, pitch 

> On 13-feb-2007, at 17:32, Reso Kiknadze wrote:

>> just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each 

>> containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number destinared 

>> 0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69 100 

>> detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via 'write') 

>> it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate 

>> understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at 

>> zero and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...

>> iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and track 

>> informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but before 

in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help"  there is a script-like  
message,
and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of lists  
(separated through commas);
it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track  
number to each list);
giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times are  
treated as one, track-independent,
so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the same  
delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one another  
directly and have delta-time 0)

---------
;
follow_gate 0;
gate_message 0;
exp_message record;

!!!!!!!!   exp_message 1000 60 127 500 1 2, 0 60 127 500 1 4, 0 63  
120 1000 1 1, 1000 66 100 400 1 2, 1000 71 95 2000 1 1, 1000 66 100  
400 1 3;  !!!!!

i coud live even with this restriction of detonate, if i would be  
able to join lists that i get as output of my former calculations and
*separate them with commas*....

> beware of the following pitfall.
> the comma is a feature of the message box.
> it enables you to enter several lists in one message box.
>
> the comma is NOT a feature of lists.
> if you are able to create  a list consisting of several smaller  
> lists separated by commas,
> it is just that, one long list.
>
> if you were to send this long list to detonate, denonate will treat  
> it as one long list,
> not as a series of smaller lists. in other words:
> detonate will not treat it as a series of delta-time, pitch  
> velocity and track number,
> as you are trying to do.
>
> HtH
> -jennek
>
> On 13-feb-2007, at 17:32, Reso Kiknadze wrote:
>
>> oh,
>>
>> just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each   
>> containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number destinared  
>> for detonate,
>>
>> e.g
>>
>> 0 60 100 100 1 1
>>
>> and
>>
>> 250 60 100 100 1 1
>> etc.
>>
>> resulting
>>
>> 0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69 100  
>> 100 1 2
>>
>>
>> detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via 'write')  
>> a multitrack midi file.
>> it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate  
>> understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at  
>> zero and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...
>>
>> iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and track  
>> informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but before  
>> seeking for them -i'd like to figure out why detonate does not  
>> work...
>>
>> anyway, thnaks for your responce/question...
>>
>> ;-)
>>
>> reagrds,
>> reso
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------------
>> Reso Kiknadze
>> composition * saxophone * electronics
>> Eschenburgstr. 13a
>> D-23568 Luebeck
>> GERMANY
>> Phone/Fax: +49 451 3885946
>> Mobile: +49 173 3467966
>> Email: reso_k@web.de
>> URL: www.reso-kiknadze.de
>>
>>
>>
>> Am 13.02.2007 um 14:32 schrieb jln:
>>
>>>
>>> Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10
>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists
>>>> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I'm not sure I get what you want to achieve... Where do you want  
>>> the coma to be kept ?
>>>
>>> In the meantime, I think sprintf should work.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Julien.
>>>
>>>
>>
>


use tosymbol to list each list with a list, and then from symbol when the master_list is parsed.

I have not worked a lot with detonate, so I cannot help you with the 

The string entered in the message box contains commas, to separate 

multiple messages and lists in the message box.

the moment this box sends out this string, it is actually cut up in 

several messages/ lists -- just where the commas are.

This results in a series of events happening at almost the same time.

I assume that this close timing is what solves your delta time issue.

Now there are other ways to generate a series of messages "at almost 

- do your calculations first, and make sure the results are not yet 

- once all the calculations are done, send them to detonate as 

- collect all (delta-time, pitch velocity track) tuples in a coll, 

- use the dump message to coll to get everything from the coll "at 

of course there is more than one way to do this.

On 14-feb-2007, at 3:10, Reso Kiknadze wrote:

> in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help" there is a script- 

> and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of 

> it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track 

> giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times are 

> so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the 

> same delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one 

> another directly and have delta-time 0)

> !!!!!!!! exp_message 1000 60 127 500 1 2, 0 60 127 500 1 4, 0 63 

> 120 1000 1 1, 1000 66 100 400 1 2, 1000 71 95 2000 1 1, 1000 66 100 

> i coud live even with this restriction of detonate, if i would be 

> able to join lists that i get as output of my former calculations and

> thanks and sorry for disturbing with this weired stuff :-)

I have not worked a lot with detonate, so I cannot help you with the  
delta time issue.

Regarding the commas:
The string entered in the message box contains commas, to separate  
multiple messages and lists in the message box.
the moment this box sends out this string, it is actually cut up in  
several messages/ lists -- just where the commas are.
This results in a series of events happening at almost the same time.
I assume that this close timing is what solves your delta time issue.

Now there are other ways to generate a series of messages "at almost  
the same time".
the trick is
- do your calculations first, and make sure the results are not yet  
sent to detonate.
- once all the calculations are done, send them to detonate as  
quickly as possible.

here is one solution:
- collect all (delta-time, pitch velocity track) tuples in a coll,  
each tuple as an individual entry
- use the dump message to coll to get everything from the coll "at  
almost the same time"
of course there is more than one way to do this.

> hi jennek,
>
> thamks for your reply,
>
> that's what i was trying; -
>
> in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help"  there is a script- 
> like message,
> and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of  
> lists (separated through commas);
> it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track  
> number to each list);
> giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times are  
> treated as one, track-independent,
> so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the  
> same delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one  
> another directly and have delta-time 0)
>
> e.g line 4 in the example below:
>
> ---------
> ;
> follow_gate 0;
> gate_message 0;
> exp_message record;
>
> !!!!!!!!   exp_message 1000 60 127 500 1 2, 0 60 127 500 1 4, 0 63  
> 120 1000 1 1, 1000 66 100 400 1 2, 1000 71 95 2000 1 1, 1000 66 100  
> 400 1 3;  !!!!!
>
> exp_message stop;
> --------
>
> i coud live even with this restriction of detonate, if i would be  
> able to join lists that i get as output of my former calculations and
> *separate them with commas*....
>
> that's what i'm trying to solve...
>
> thanks and sorry for disturbing with this weired stuff :-)
>
> r
>
> -------------------------------------
> Reso Kiknadze
> composition * saxophone * electronics
> Eschenburgstr. 13a
> D-23568 Luebeck
> GERMANY
> Phone/Fax: +49 451 3885946
> Mobile: +49 173 3467966
> Email: reso_k@web.de
> URL: www.reso-kiknadze.de
>
>
>
> Am 13.02.2007 um 20:26 schrieb jennek geels:
>
>> beware of the following pitfall.
>> the comma is a feature of the message box.
>> it enables you to enter several lists in one message box.
>>
>> the comma is NOT a feature of lists.
>> if you are able to create  a list consisting of several smaller  
>> lists separated by commas,
>> it is just that, one long list.
>>
>> if you were to send this long list to detonate, denonate will  
>> treat it as one long list,
>> not as a series of smaller lists. in other words:
>> detonate will not treat it as a series of delta-time, pitch  
>> velocity and track number,
>> as you are trying to do.
>>
>> HtH
>> -jennek
>>
>> On 13-feb-2007, at 17:32, Reso Kiknadze wrote:
>>
>>> oh,
>>>
>>> just between two and more (aktually about fifty!) lists, each   
>>> containing delta-time, pitch, velocity and track number  
>>> destinared for detonate,
>>>
>>> e.g
>>>
>>> 0 60 100 100 1 1
>>>
>>> and
>>>
>>> 250 60 100 100 1 1
>>> etc.
>>>
>>> resulting
>>>
>>> 0 60 100 100 1 1, 250 60 100 100 1 1, 0 66 100 100 1 2, 250 69  
>>> 100 100 1 2
>>>
>>>
>>> detonate should get it as a text message, and output (via  
>>> 'write') a multitrack midi file.
>>> it should be an emergency trick, because i can't get detonate  
>>> understand, that delta-times for another track should begin at  
>>> zero and not be appended to deltas of the previous track...
>>>
>>> iM afraid there are more efiicient ways to address pitch and  
>>> track informations resulted from a lot of list operations, but  
>>> before seeking for them -i'd like to figure out why detonate does  
>>> not work...
>>>
>>> anyway, thnaks for your responce/question...
>>>
>>> ;-)
>>>
>>> reagrds,
>>> reso
>>>
>>>
>>> -------------------------------------
>>> Reso Kiknadze
>>> composition * saxophone * electronics
>>> Eschenburgstr. 13a
>>> D-23568 Luebeck
>>> GERMANY
>>> Phone/Fax: +49 451 3885946
>>> Mobile: +49 173 3467966
>>> Email: reso_k@web.de
>>> URL: www.reso-kiknadze.de
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Am 13.02.2007 um 14:32 schrieb jln:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Quote: Reso Kiknadze wrote on Tue, 13 February 2007 14:10
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists
>>>>> with 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?
>>>>
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> I'm not sure I get what you want to achieve... Where do you want  
>>>> the coma to be kept ?
>>>>
>>>> In the meantime, I think sprintf should work.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Julien.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>


On 14 Feb 2007, at 03:10, Reso Kiknadze wrote:

i haven't been following too closely what you are trying to do, but i 

think this comma business in lists is not the right way to go.

why not collect your data in one big list (without commas) using 

whatever objects you like and breaking it down into chunks of desired 

On 14 Feb 2007, at 03:10, Reso Kiknadze wrote:
> e.g line 4 in the example below:
>
> ---------
> ;
> follow_gate 0;
> gate_message 0;
> exp_message record;
>
> !!!!!!!!   exp_message 1000 60 127 500 1 2, 0 60 127 500 1 4, 0 63  
> 120 1000 1 1, 1000 66 100 400 1 2, 1000 71 95 2000 1 1, 1000 66 100  
> 400 1 3;  !!!!!
>
> exp_message stop;
> --------
>
> i coud live even with this restriction of detonate, if i would be  
> able to join lists that i get as output of my former calculations and
> *separate them with commas*....

i haven't been following too closely what you are trying to do, but i  
think this comma business in lists is not the right way to go.
why not collect your data in one big list (without commas) using  
whatever objects you like and breaking it down into chunks of desired  
size with something like [zl group] ?
seems to me like this should work.
volker.

If you need independent track timing, why not have multiple detonate 

One more thought:
If you need independent track timing, why not have multiple detonate  
objects?
one for each track.

> in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help"  there is a script- 
> like message,
> and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of  
> lists (separated through commas);
> it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track  
> number to each list);
> giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times are  
> treated as one, track-independent,
> so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the  
> same delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one  
> another directly and have delta-time 0)
>


several detonates won#t give me a single multitrack file i'm afraid...

the thing you suggested me with coll sounds like a solution ...

i did the similar thing with collecting pitch values in a table and 

sending them out in correct wanted order(s)

i have to spend some time with coll now, i guess..

Am 14.02.2007 um 09:13 schrieb jennek geels:

> If you need independent track timing, why not have multiple 

> On 14-feb-2007, at 3:10, Reso Kiknadze wrote:

>> in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help" there is a script- 

>> and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of 

>> it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track 

>> giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times 

>> are treated as one, track-independent,

>> so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the 

>> same delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one 

>> another directly and have delta-time 0)

the thing you suggested me with coll sounds like a solution ...
i did the similar thing with collecting pitch values in a table and  
sending them out in correct wanted order(s)
via uzi and counter;

> Hi Reso,
>
> One more thought:
> If you need independent track timing, why not have multiple  
> detonate objects?
> one for each track.
>
> HtH
> -jennek
>
> On 14-feb-2007, at 3:10, Reso Kiknadze wrote:
>
>> in the 'detonate example' of "detonate help"  there is a script- 
>> like message,
>> and exp_message makes it possible to give detonate a series of  
>> lists (separated through commas);
>> it works fine for one track a (adding the sixth member for track  
>> number to each list);
>> giving different trck numbers works too, exept that delta times  
>> are treated as one, track-independent,
>> so that i can not position simultaneous events (giving them the  
>> same delta-time, e.g. 0, or 250), unless the lists follow one  
>> another directly and have delta-time 0)
>>
>


> i've got a problem joining lists and need your help:

> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists with 

> 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

In Max, list, don't, contain, eh commas. Anything with a comma will do 

the opposite, of joining, its seperating...

For your detonate problem, you need to think in seperate 

lists/commands/events, there is no need to deal with commas at all. Look 

into the zl series of list treatement. Especially [zl reg], [zl queue], 

[zl group] also coll is nice to organise things, you can dump the 

content of a coll at once, which creates seperated messages of the 

> i've got a problem joining lists and need your help:
>
> is there any way to keep already appended komma when joninig lists with 
> 'join' or 'collect' or other lis operator?

In Max, list, don't, contain, eh commas. Anything with a comma will do 
the opposite, of joining, its seperating...
(This, is even, true, for, english ;-)

For your detonate problem, you need to think in seperate 
lists/commands/events, there is no need to deal with commas at all. Look 
into the zl series of list treatement. Especially [zl reg], [zl queue], 
[zl group] also coll is nice to organise things, you can dump the 
content of a coll at once, which creates seperated messages of the 
content...

-- 
Stefan Tiedje------------x-------
--_____-----------|--------------
--(_|_ ----|-----|-----()-------
-- _|_)----|-----()--------------
----------()--------www.ccmix.com


komma between joined lists