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bruno

I just got the new Ultraleap device. The control panel is working with an M1 Mac / Monterey. Is somebody already working on a way to integrate it into Max?

I just got the new Ultraleap device. The control panel is working with an M1 Mac / Monterey. 

ultraleap-leapmotion

Oooh, where'd you get it from? I only saw it as a pre-order on the webpage.

I guess GECO has been updated, if you don't mind middleware:

https://cdm.link/2023/07/geco-for-ultraleap/

I too am interested in this subject as I'm hoping to incorporate one into a drum setup.

I guess GECO has been updated, if you don't mind middleware:
https://uwyn.com/geco/ 

(this is from a recent cdm article):
https://cdm.link/2023/07/geco-for-ultraleap/ 

Unfortunately, from looking at the GECO docs, it's a pretty blunt instrument. No finger/joint tracking, so you can't calculate finger bends/touches or anything like that. I also don't see any indication that the OSC output is anything other than midi-style 7-bit resolution. Maybe there's more info on their Discord server, but for some reason it's 'unable to accept invite', for me at least...

Does look like Leap does have a beta at least for hand tracking hope...

https://developer.leapmotion.com/tracking-software-download

Unfortunately, from looking at the GECO docs, it's a pretty blunt instrument. No finger/joint tracking, so you can't calculate finger bends/touches or anything like that. I also don't see any indication that the OSC output is anything other than midi-style 7-bit resolution.  Maybe there's more info on their Discord server, but for some reason it's 'unable to accept invite', for me at least...

Does look like Leap does have a beta at least for hand tracking  hope...

https://developer.leapmotion.com/tracking-software-download 

Was looking at the GECO page yesterday and it looks like you can send 14-bit MIDI, so I imagine the OSC would be something similar to that (an assumption as I've not tested it).

High-resolution 14-bit MIDI support with customizable fine message number

High-resolution OSC support with customizable paths and OSC server selection

Also had a look a there used to be a couple different leapmotion externals, but I think those are all abandonware at the moment since the leapmotion1's support got discontinued by leapmotion.

It would be great to have some kind of native (external?) way to parse the data from it as I'm always a bit dubious of middleware for performance and consistency reasons.

edit: from the webpage:
High-resolution 14-bit MIDI support with customizable fine message number
High-resolution OSC support with customizable paths and OSC server selection

Leapmotion was great - there was aka.leapmotion for Max. I built a very well working theremin patch with it, but then it didn't work anymore with Mac updates. I hope, we find a way again with the new controller.

Leapmotion was great - there was aka.leapmotion for Max. I built a very well working theremin patch  with it, but then it didn't work anymore with Mac updates. I hope, we find a way again with the new controller.

I use the IRCAM leapmotion object with my V1, works great in Big Sur, at least. Perhaps they're working on an update for Gemini....

It is true that the older drivers got discontinued but fortunately the new drivers also work for the older leapmotion 1 controller. I've just tried it and it's working better than before. I've bought GECO and it's working but I would rather prefer the "external" solution, since it gives you access to a lot more...

I only briefly played with the externals back in the day. It's promising if the new drivers work. I wonder what that means for the v2 version. Hopefully IRCAM gets one and updates things for it.

Years ago, I used GECO successfully for a while, but it was lacking some of the things I needed (see MATTYO's comments above). However, you guys might want to have a look at 

 by MIMU (both OSX and Windows), designed for use with the MIMU gloves and the Leap Motion, now also supporting Gemini.

I've got Leap 2 running under Gemini on M1, via Unity -> OSC -> Max 8. Not all parameters are useful for me and choices had to be made since there is definitely a data bottleneck. At the moment, I'm using speedlim to curtail the stream but that is not ideal - should be done at the C# source. In my clip, you can see the hand tracking in Unity on the left, and I built a calibrator, as you can see on the right side. The latter is needed to set up "playable" areas. Now comes the testing phase. I will report ;-)

Years ago, I used GECO successfully for a while, but it was lacking some of the things I needed (see MATTYO's comments above). However, you guys might want to have a look at GLOVER by MIMU (both OSX and Windows), designed for use with the MIMU gloves and the Leap Motion, now also supporting Gemini.
I've got Leap 2 running under Gemini on M1, via Unity -> OSC -> Max 8. Not all parameters are useful for me and choices had to be made since there is definitely a data bottleneck. At the moment, I'm using speedlim to curtail the stream but that is not ideal - should be done at the C# source. In my clip, you can see the hand tracking in Unity on the left, and I built a calibrator, as you can see on the right side. The latter is needed to set up "playable" areas. Now comes the testing phase. I will report ;-)

Ah nice, the latency/tracking looks pretty tight.

I did look at GLOVER but it looks like you can't get finger positions and smaller details, with most of it being focused on the broader gesture stuff (similar to GECO).

Since you have one set up, do you find it tracks even remotely ok if you have it oriented in this manner? (I saw something about being able to define 

 the sensor was relative to the hands like if you have it mounted on a headset)

leap.jpg

Since you have one set up, do you find it tracks even remotely ok if you have it oriented in this manner? (I saw something about being able to define where the sensor was relative to the hands like if you have it mounted on a headset)


I haven't looked at different orientations yet, but I do know there is a dedicated "screentop" mode next to desktop and VR modes. There is no dedicated app though, like there use to be in earlier versions. Instead, setting it up in another mode means changing my Unity setup (or C, or Unreal). As soon as I find the time, I will look at that.

The general latency is ok, but as said, for as yet, I need to use speedlim to limit the amount of data. We're working on that one.

Thanks, Rodrigo.
I haven't looked at different orientations yet, but I do know there is a dedicated "screentop" mode next to desktop and VR modes. There is no dedicated app though, like there use to be in earlier versions. Instead, setting it up in another mode means changing my Unity setup (or C, or Unreal). As soon as I find the time, I will look at that.
The general latency is ok, but as said, for as yet, I need to use speedlim to limit the amount of data. We're working on that one.

Just in general: I liked the Ircam external very much, but there were also things missing.

Awesome, do let me know if you have a chance to check. I basically haven't bought a v2 yet as my v1 has comfortably sat in a drawer unused for years...

My current/intended use case is mounting one sideways on a drum with the idea of picking up my hands moving in it's FOV, like so:

b63920e03d49e03115dbf59fc5693a89989ee838.jpeg

So if it works in that orientation, that's hopeful/promising, and if it doesn't, it moves far lower in priority of things to get/test.

My current/intended use case is mounting one sideways on a drum with the idea of picking up my hands moving in it's FOV, like so:


BTW, Alisa Kobzar and I are more than willing to release the Unity C# script on Github, but without the connecting maxpat that wouldn't make sense and I still have huge issues to deal with bringing the OSC into M4L - under time pressure. Guess? Yes, indeed, the dreaded live.remote~ to LOM-map things. So please bear with me.

It would be great to have a maxpat as was aka.leapmotion - I think, the ultraleap could be a great tool for gesture controlled music - I used the old leapmotion version e.g. for a very well functioning Theremin.

I know, Bruno. But the aka.leapmotion was a Max external, so that needs someone diving into C/C++.

The Unity approach (C#) has the advantage that it is relatively easy to integrate it with games & 3D animation. There are so many people using Unity for different purposes. For many younger programmers, it is their very first platform...

I know, Bruno. But the aka.leapmotion was a Max external, so that needs someone diving into C/C++.
The Unity approach (C#) has the advantage that it is relatively easy to integrate it with games & 3D animation. There are so many people using Unity for different purposes. For many younger programmers, it is their very first platform...

I'd love to have the Unity C# sooner as a thing to start with :)

Sorry - in my old age I am a slow learner.... so, it seems, I have to wait, until somebody cares to write a new Max patch with the same functions as aka.leapmotion....

Geco looks great, seems maintained and updated, and should work perfectly with Max. curious what about it is limiting folks from using as a solution for modern leapmotion useage ?

Not downloaded/played with it, but I think the GECO thing doesn't offer the full level of detail/granularity that the external versions offered (in terms of tracking individual fingers etc...).

aha, that's unfortunate. can't imagine why they wouldn't just pipe everything over based on some setting.

That would be useful, like an "advanced mode". Maybe it has something like that, but the webpage is quite sparse on info, but as far as I can tell it's more oriented around piping over gesture-to-MIDI mappings.

the short version : I'm working on a new UltraLeap / LeapMotion external ;

I’ve been using LeapMotions A LOT since 2014 in many different projects (music, installation, VR, ..)

I think I used all the available max externals and other 'bridge' softwares (leap to MIDI, OSC, …) !

Lots of fun... and frustrations, because almost every new version of the drivers break the externals that most of the time were never updated…

The Leap Motion hardware hasn't changed for almost 10 years, but drivers have received lots of incredible updates over the years, improving tracking drastically. This device is still amazing, I really love it !

+ new Leap Motion 2 is arriving on the market, and up to date drivers are finally available on macOs :-)

Tired of waiting for some hypothetical new external (or official support of this device in Max), I've decided to hire a developer to help me create a new leapmotion / ultraleap external.

I’m unable to create such an external from scratch myself, but I think I should be able to fine tune it once I have something that connects to the SDK and returns some data...

I want to make an open source external and distribute it for free.

I saved some $€ to start paying the dev, and I’m looking for a way to fund this project.

I don’t want to make money with this project, just fairly pay a couple of days of work to a talented developer and share the external with the community.

(the talented developer /friend of mine is : 

We will share the external and source code on github as soon as we get something working.

Ultraleap / Leapmotion